Ok, Ok, Let's Talk Trans

[shortkut]

I wonder what type of correspondence it is. We have to have names, addresses, and genders in the patient chart match what the insurance has or we cannot bill. We put pop up alerts for patients who want different pronouns or names, but the chart would still say male for Crystal unless it was changed with health insurance

 

[Raine]

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[Crystal]

So I don't know how best to explain it and I'd rather not show them since it's got a lot of PII and talks a lot about suicide and...well...the plans, and makes me feel pathetic because it mentions my support structure which, in my home life, consists of exactly no one...so let's just call them patient notes that I don't think were meant to be seen by me.

 

[Raine]

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[Crystal]

Even addresses her emails to me Hi Crystal. I mean...I get it, she doesn't deal with lots of trans people, she's more focused on the whole suicide thing...but...come on.

 

[shortkut]

So I don't know how best to explain it and I'd rather not show them since it's got a lot of PII and talks a lot about suicide and...well...the plans, and makes me feel pathetic because it mentions my support structure which, in my home life, consists of exactly no one...so let's just call them patient notes that I don't think were meant to be seen by me.

Can you have us included in your support structure?

 

[Crystal]

I don't know how to explain mythical creatures from the depths of the interwebs, also Canada.

 

[Tubby23]

I don't know how to explain mythical creatures from the depths of the interwebs, also Canada.

Also upside down people

 

[Crystal]

Also upside down people

Agreed, you weirdos, too!

 

[Raine]

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[Mark]

I don't know how to explain mythical creatures from the depths of the interwebs, also Canada.

You can’t explain the Canadians, but you can at least just be honest with her. If you’re not willing to be transparent about something as simple as what boils down to a forum where you receive online support, how can you expect to be honest about other, potentially more uncomfortable truths?

It might seem insignificant, but if you’re uncomfortable with the thought of how to mention something like that… what could that say about other things that make you uncomfortable? That could be detrimental to providing you the adequate help and support needed.

 

[Crystal]

 

[Crystal]

Okay. ... Bottom line, is she helping you? Do you feel that's true? 'Cause that's the most important thing, obviously. I would definitely talk to her about the misgendering, at least, caution her how that's not really helping the job she is attempting to do and could jeopardize the safety of any future trans clients she may have.

I perfectly understand and appreciate your and/or her reluctance to trust deviants from the interwebs. But, fucking seriously - how can we help? Where do we start?

I think she helps, and yeah, I plan to bring up the misgendering. That felt like a betrayal, honestly.

You can’t explain the Canadians, but you can at least just be honest with her. If you’re not willing to be transparent about something as simple as what boils down to a forum where you receive online support, how can you expect to be honest about other, potentially more uncomfortable truths?

It might seem insignificant, but if you’re uncomfortable with the thought of how to mention something like that… what could that say about other things that make you uncomfortable? That could be detrimental to providing you the adequate help and support needed.

Well I was more joking than anything, but yeah, my original therapist knows I have a few communities I'm involved in, this one being the core of people I've known the longest and more active in helping/shouting at me for being a moron

 

[canadaguy]

You can’t explain the Canadians, but you can at least just be honest with her. If you’re not willing to be transparent about something as simple as what boils down to a forum where you receive online support, how can you expect to be honest about other, potentially more uncomfortable truths?

It might seem insignificant, but if you’re uncomfortable with the thought of how to mention something like that… what could that say about other things that make you uncomfortable? That could be detrimental to providing you the adequate help and support needed.

Even the Canadians can't explain the Canadians

 

[Crystal]

Even the Canadians can't explain the Canadians

Sawry!

 

[Mark]

Well I was more joking than anything, but yeah, my original therapist knows I have a few communities I'm involved in, this one being the core of people I've known the longest and more active in helping/shouting at me for being a moron

Just making sure, dude… a lot of people make that mistake when they speak to people about their problems. For anything from pride to shame, people will deliberately withhold information that could be vital to their success in therapy.

I get it. It took a lot to get me to be up front about the shit in my head, it doesn’t feel like lying because you’re just withholding the information… but the end result is still the same. Trust me, some of the things I’ve admitted here about my mental health were hard to even speak let alone type out and read and put out there for you all to read. But… if it’ll make one of you fuckers be honest with yourselves and help someone, then it’s worth putting myself out there in order to help someone else feel comfortable doing it.

Even the Canadians can't explain the Canadians

Says “canadaguy” who just ACCURATELY DESCRIBED CANADIANS IN ONE SENTENCE.

 

[Crystal]

Just making sure, dude… a lot of people make that mistake when they speak to people about their problems. For anything from pride to shame, people will deliberately withhold information that could be vital to their success in therapy.

I get it. It took a lot to get me to be up front about the shit in my head, it doesn’t feel like lying because you’re just withholding the information… but the end result is still the same. Trust me, some of the things I’ve admitted here about my mental health were hard to even speak let alone type out and read and put out there for you all to read. But… if it’ll make one of you fuckers be honest with yourselves and help someone, then it’s worth putting myself out there in order to help someone else feel comfortable doing it.

It took me 30+ years to start therapy, so yeah, I get it. Hardest thing I've ever done is be open about myself to someone. Second hardest was the second the visit. No hiding now, it's all out there.

Says “canadaguy” who just ACCURATELY DESCRIBED CANADIANS IN ONE SENTENCE.

 

[Raine]

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[Crystal]

Good. I'll stop frantically flailing for now, then.

Offer to help still stands. Like I don't care who it is - Mark, Cole, Foxy, one of these pesky Maple Syrup Moose - I'll (help) ship their asses your way with the quickness if you're in a bad way.

Send me Al's bank account.

Absolutely!

I don't remember what I've written and where, exactly, it's been more than like 5 hours. But, I was in the process of deleting myself from the internet when GWF came down the pipe. I originally had no intention of sharing like... 90% of what I have already. I ain't proud of none of it, and we ain't exactly young - but if my sharing helps someone, then, there's no room for shame or regret.

You're amazing, that's the primary difference between me and you. I'm glad you didn't delete yourself from the internet, I'd never have had the chance to truly chat with you, just having this outlet with you and @Fire Queen is wonderful, and the other trans members we have. And our old buds who are now old and on buds.

 

[Raine]

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[Crystal]

I'll put Top Men on it ASAP! I'm sure Al would understand.

Atta' girl!

That's sweet! We're "guilty" of the same stuff though, I'm just further along the road of smacking my demons and skeletons upside their noggins. You're already pretty great, and you'll be even better once the dominoes start to fall and things come into alignment. You'll see.

I hope so, I'm tired of being a burden for everyone to bear. I'd like to be more than a self-hating sack of misery, to shift the imposter syndrome accept myself for who I am.

It's like home, gives me that warm fuzzy feeling and second-hand contact high.

I blame @Mark

Unfortunately something I will/can never try myself because of the potential for increased paranoia, but people swear by it!

Yeah, I had that issue, unpleasant. Why I never bothered turning it into a habit.

 

[Kat]

Ugh, doctors misgendering their patients is so obnoxious. They opened a clinic near me recently that does gender affirming surgeries, and part of the training was teaching the medical people they needed to keep using the right pronouns even after the patient was out. Like, you're literally performing surgery on them to affirm their gender and you still have to be told which pronouns to use? It makes my head hurt. (The training included that because it'd been a frequent problem, they weren't just being thorough.)

I actually do have a sex-related curiosity. How personal and raunchy of a question am I allowed to ask you ladies?

 

[Crystal]

Ugh, doctors misgendering their patients is so obnoxious. They opened a clinic near me recently that does gender affirming surgeries, and part of the training was teaching the medical people they needed to keep using the right pronouns even after the patient was out. Like, you're literally performing surgery on them to affirm their gender and you still have to be told which pronouns to use? It makes my head hurt. (The training included that because it'd been a frequent problem, they weren't just being thorough.)

You should try being trans in an ER here. Not only do they make you feel terrible for being trans, they make you feel half a foot tall when they do correctly gender you.

"please take this...lady to room 16. Follower her, miss." While standing right next to the convenient warning that assaulting hospital staff or even talking angrily at them is a felony. Fun!

I actually do have a sex-related curiosity. How personal and raunchy of a question am I allowed to ask you ladies?

No limits, I am here for anything, though I don't hold either @Warp or @Fire Queen to those standards, their limits are their own

 

[Raine]

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[Crystal]

That's a thing now...? That's equal parts sad and depressing, but post-COVID especially I get it.

it sure is, I'll try and take a pic of it next time I go to the ER...inevitably that'll be soon, lol.

Also, part of the problem myself unfortunately. I have been kindly escorted out of an ER before because some absolute scum night shift stooge essentially botched some sort of anal examination on my mother (I think she was stool impacted? I don't fully remember), and then left her in the gurney bleeding and with no pain medicine. I asked politely, at first. Even then I wasn't a complete jackass... j-just mostly! But I also had a hair trigger temper and I may have asked ~15 minutes later how the doctor would feel if I sodomized him after receiving a flippant and dismissive response.

Ok, I'm flying you out to my GCS in 70 years or so when I can afford it. I want the doctors good and scared to be sure they do the damn thing right!

...Yeah there's no way I get away with shit like that these days. lol

No, definitely not, those signs are in the waiting room, the triage area, the hallways AND the patient rooms, even in doctors' offices. No avoiding them

Considering your girlfriend, I know you know... but there's a world of difference between "do what you want, it's your body" and "I believe and support you." You catch on real quick to exactly how people phrase things, because of situations like this - they don't believe what they're saying. They're just saying it because someone's told them to.

Very. Very. Very. True. Dealt with it more than a few times, and it's near impossible not to feel it. I'm ok being the target of that, I'm an easy one, but most aren't ready to be subjected to that kind of scorn, nor should they have to face it. Really it's just plain awful that being able to spout a few lines is enough to cover their ass when their intentions, thoughts and ideas are clear as day.

It's why Crystal's psychiatrist writing the wrong pronouns legitimately had me heated last night. Like, it's one thing to say it. But writing it, especially multiple times, takes conscious and knowing effort.

Uh, from the above, the temper is almost entirely gone now. I get in really bad headspaces though, where I just want to sleep instead of shattering the world.

I'm entirely too stupid to back down and I lived as a man for 30-odd years, so bring on the raunch? Famous last words and all that.

Is it a good thing or a bad thing that we have experience with man-brain level raunchy thoughts? I wish I didn't have those kind of insights into a male brain, but at the same time, I guess it's also helpful...

 

[Kat]

So presumably you have sex, and have done so after you realized and embraced being a woman but still had a dick. I'm guessing (perhaps incorrectly) you typically don't like to think too much about that thing, but it's the focus at least part of the time when you're getting naked with someone. Does that bother/distract you at all? Do you like/dislike dirty talk that acknowledges it (e.g. "you're so big/hard")? Are there some acts that feel weird because they're so dick-focused? Or does it not bother you at all?

 

[Kat]

Is it a good thing or a bad thing that we have experience with man-brain level raunchy thoughts? I wish I didn't have those kind of insights into a male brain, but at the same time, I guess it's also helpful...

Are your thoughts less raunchy now?

 

[Crystal]

So presumably you have sex, and have done so after you realized and embraced being a woman but still had a dick. I'm guessing (perhaps incorrectly) you typically don't like to think too much about that thing, but it's the focus at least part of the time when you're getting naked with someone. Does that bother/distract you at all? Do you like/dislike dirty talk that acknowledges it (e.g. "you're so big/hard")? Are there some acts that feel weird because they're so dick-focused? Or does it not bother you at all?

So I'm going to spoiler this response because it's an interesting one, but I can guarantee it'll be different from any other responses...go me for being weird?

Spoiler: probably best not to read this

Ok, I'm going to dive straight into the most pathetic fact about myself -- Never had penetrative sex (to completion). I just can't. I had once incident when I was 23 that just proved how much of a man I wasn't. She needed me to be something I just plain couldn't be, but me being an idiot and her being aroused, well...I tried. It broke my brain so badly I pretty much switched off and broke down. The second my brain realized I had this disgusting thing inside of her...mind break. Gone. I was completely switched off emotionally for four days because I felt like a complete animal, a total monster. She, of course, left me, because she needed something I couldn't give her and I won't deny that I've pretty much avoided serious relationships since then. That isn't to say I haven't had fun in other ways with women, but anytime that particular part of my own anatomy is a talking point in a sexual way, it's game over for me. So yes, it's an instant distraction and an instant turn off for me if that comes up. I'm exceptionally dysphoric in that particular way, and yeah, it's quite a hurdle for some, so...yeah...

I could lie, talk about these amazing sexual conquests, one after the other, but no...I'm as pathetic as I seem.

 

[Crystal]

Are your thoughts less raunchy now?

Decidedly so. Not to say I don't still have sexual thoughts, just nothing like what they used to be. Also don't have any impulse to satiate the typical male needs anymore. I always felt disgusting when that particular need arose, I would go as long as I could before it became...uncomfortable...and then ugh. It's been months at this point, and I'm in no way, shape or form interested in tending to...that. The thoughts still go down those paths, I still am attracted to women, I still very much know what attraction is, I just don't get the typical need associated with that.

 

[Raine]

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[Crystal]

Something that always irritated me was that there would be a completely different change in mood, mindset and priorities before and after release. The entire experience was a goddamn chore more often than not, and that's not really an issue anymore.

^^SO MUCH THIS!!! It was awful! Ugh, it needs attention again. Eww, this is disgusting. That was horrible and I feel nothing but guilt and shame.

I know the knickknacks are adorable, love, but they have them elsewhere too you know!

I'm a frequent flier at the ER, I get issues with pain frequently. They think I'm there for the drugs, mostly, but I generally can't stand what they use, I just need that relief. Those opioids make me feel sick, so I only take them when I am desperate, otherwise I don't touch them. So definitely not in it for the drugs. But if you go there enough for pain issues, that's all they assume.

Pfft, I hear that. It's a plan, ~110 year old trans woman beats doctor with cane to ensure smooth surgery!

YAS!

I'll be honest, I've always been somewhere between being okay with and absolutely loving men being scared shitless of me. One of the only good things about being a miniature giant. I've always, always hated women being remotely scared of me though. I'm... not entirely sure if that's a toxic masculinity thing, or a defense mechanism, or part of playing the role - like, I never had a positive male role model. So, I definitely wanted to fulfill that role for my younger brother. ...The world has a strange sense of humor.

I'm the same, I don't think I've ever intimidated a man, I'm only 6'1, not giant sized like you . But I have definitely made women uncomfortable just being around and I HATE that, so so much. I'm the least threatening person, but I'm trapped in a meat coffin that belongs to someone far more masculine.

It would be more helpful if we were into men, I'm sure... all this really helps with is being capable of making completely outlandish jokes land with ease!

Fair, though given my level of dysphoria with that particular anatomy, I'm very glad I didn't wind up being attracted to men, lol.

 

[Raine]

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[Kat]

Thanks for sharing. I know everyone is different so probably feelings run the gambit, but I still appreciate hearing your personal experiences.

Interesting about the man sex brain. It's not my personal experience that women are less interested in sex than men, so I always assumed that stereotype was nonsense I suppose there's lots of reasons mine could be a skewed sample.

 

[Crystal]

Thanks for sharing. I know everyone is different so probably feelings run the gambit, but I still appreciate hearing your personal experiences.

Interesting about the man sex brain. It's not my personal experience that women are less interested in sex than men, so I always assumed that stereotype was nonsense I suppose there's lots of reasons mine could be a skewed sample.

Going to respond to Warp in just a second, but I saw this and wanted to just say I think there's a bit of a disconnect between what male interest is and what female interest is. I'm still interested in engaging in sexual acts, just not with one particular area of my present anatomy. So those feelings of interest in sex are still there, the urge, the NEED for it is what has gone. Male arousal is far, far more primal in nature than female arousal. At least from the differing experiences I've had.

 

[Crystal]

Ohhh, okay! Also not ideal, but understandable. I can't remember if I've mentioned this before or not, but I have Congenital Spinal Stenosis - a narrow spinal canal, in layman's terms - and two ruptured discs from a fall down a flight of stairs as a young adult, and they don't play nicely together. So, yeah, familiar enough with how ERs function and how they're constantly thinking you're a junkie looking for a high.

Ouch. That hurts just reading it! I'm sorry you have to deal with the spinal stenosis and the ruptured discs, just one would be awful, both...geez.

My family has a long, sordid history with substance abuse/dependency so the only way I'm taking something stronger than, like, Flexeril is if I'm in the ER because I couldn't move anymore. October's "vacation" was a hoot, they gave my dumb ass morphine and got me high as fuck. I'd never been legitimately high before. I don't think I like it. Not feeling like my back and hips were exploding was great though.

My brother took his own life by getting painkillers from some friend and mixing them with alcohol, so I totally understand the family history side. He had issues with drink mostly, but he was familiar with drugs, too.

Morphine was my best friend when I had surgery at 14, my first major surgery. They gave me an IV bag of morphine and a button to push to get more. Most people are out of it by the time the dose finishes delivering, not me, I was strong enough for a double hit. They wondered why I kept going through morphine so fast. You're giving a 14 year old a button to take the everything away...fuck yeah I'm using it! It made me violently sick afterwards, but it was worth it.

For whatever it's worth, I found out that I have a fairly aggressive resting face - which was definitely not made better by constantly being worked up and overthinking everything. The size makes it harder to immediately appear less intimidating, granted, but there are definitely some more neutral/friendly facial expressions and general movements that seem to help? Could also just be that ladies in small towns are way more on edge than big city ladies, I would probably have needed to return to the black hole over in the Midwest more often to be sure. But fuck that!

Should've asked @The Eye in the Sky! for tips on how to be tall and unintimidating. Granted, I think he's the level of tall that just looks silly, so perhaps not...

@Cole -- confirm or deny that for us?

Sorry, boys, dragging you into our trans talk

That would certainly be an additional layer of unpleasantness you could've done without!

I don't know how I would have handled that situation. Too awful to contemplate.

I will admit to having experimented somewhat. Been wrong about damn near everything else, wanted to make sure despite being pretty certain. Can confirm, men are icky (to me).

Experimenting is fine, lets you know for sure that uh-uh, that's not for me.

 

[Kat]

Going to respond to Warp in just a second, but I saw this and wanted to just say I think there's a bit of a disconnect between what male interest is and what female interest is. I'm still interested in engaging in sexual acts, just not with one particular area of my present anatomy. So those feelings of interest in sex are still there, the urge, the NEED for it is what has gone. Male arousal is far, far more primal in nature than female arousal. At least from the differing experiences I've had.

I think it's hard to wrap my brain around it since I haven't experienced the difference personally. Someone needs to start giving surveys to people who have gone through hormone therapy. We could learn so much about how hormones affect us.

 

[Crystal]

I think it's hard to wrap my brain around it since I haven't experienced the difference personally. Someone needs to start giving surveys to people who have gone through hormone therapy. We could learn so much about how hormones affect us.

Yeah, agreed, and I'm sure if one of our trans male users were to chime in they would probably say the same thing as what I'm saying, but in reverse. Their...needs...become more primal, more in tune with what I used to experience. It's hard to put into perspective until you have experienced both sides, so I suppose that's one advantage trans people have...I guess...because there are most definitely differences in how sexual interest and needs work between male and female.

 

[Raine]

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[Crystal]

Also because all of my experiences are happening relatively super late in life.

I mean, I'm no spring chicken, hon

Oh no, I'm sorry to hear that!

I want to say something about my brother, but I'd best leave it out of this thread. Suffice it to say, I've more than made my peace with his passing, but thank you

All that shit scares me, for sure. Hell, even interactions between drugs has me double-checking things just to be safe whenever I get something new added in.

Yeah, agreed, it's so important to know what you're taking and how it can interact with anything else. I have 5 morning meds and 9 nighttime meds...I'm constantly looking up how meds interact, or worrying about them, like when I was bugging the hell out of @shortkut about risperidone

I could definitely imagine the sickness afterwards, but yeah - when you're in pain, damn, having an out is far too appealing. Which is (one of the reasons) why Purdue and co need to fuck off into the sun, pushing that all out there without a care. A good chunk of my hometown is still addicted to Oxy and Percocet, or have otherwise just moved on to Heroin. Shit sucks.

Oh I'm so with you there, there are so, so many people who get given the strongest of opioids for no reason. It's so, so dangerous, they're not toys and they can have devastating consequences.

Yeah, best to leave that rock unturned. If it ain't doing anything for ya anyway, no need to even consider rocking the boat more than it already is!

That's true, this is a journey with enough rocks and rolls without adding extras needlessly.

 

[Fire Queen]

Spoiler: tmi time

okay so i’ve been transitioning since 2018 when i was 26, i’m 31 now. i started transitioning when i was single and have been in a committed relationship for the past three and a half years. the sex drive crash is real, but that’s probably less the estrogen and more likely the testosterone blockers i was taking. the dysphoria was and is very real and very much an aspect of sex being a way steeper hill to climb sometimes, but hrt helps. my body still doesn’t look the way i’d want it to but i’ve taken the steps to make it look way closer to it and that helps. it also helps that i’ve surrounded myself with friends and loved ones who see me the way i want to be seen. my fiancée plays the biggest role in that. she’s cartoonishly attracted to me (and vice versa) and we have a lot of Fun. thanks to her (and some other select friends) i’ve come to have really embraced the idea that one of the core facets of being gay and being happy is finding yourself attractive. breaking out of straight norms was another one of the biggest steps towards me not dissociating during any sexual experience.

also not having a refractory period anymore RULES

 

[Crystal]

Spoiler: spoilering just in case

I'm glad you're surrounded by people who love you and who help you love yourself @Fire Queen, and I hope you're recovering well!

 

[Crystal]

I know the knickknacks are adorable, love, but they have them elsewhere too you know!

Told you! I'm there now. When I'm alone I'll take a pic of the poster about no abuse of nursing staff

 

[Crystal]

Forgot to take a pic in the room, so grabbed this on the way out

 

[Andy]

Didn’t realise there were so many trans (and LGB) people in our little community but an online forum seems a logical place for teenagers who were trying to figure themselves out to hang around. Sad that you weren’t able to 100% be yourselves at the time but very pleased that you’re all moving in the right direction towards where you want to be!

I’m a straight white male so can’t begin to understand the difficulties you’ve had to face. I’m also not sure I’ve ever actually met a trans person in real life. Met a couple of non-binary folk which I don’t really understand the mindset but don’t have an issue with and hope that is evident in conversations. People are people. Good people are good people.

 

[Raine]

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[Crystal]

Didn’t realise there were so many trans (and LGB) people in our little community but an online forum seems a logical place for teenagers who were trying to figure themselves out to hang around. Sad that you weren’t able to 100% be yourselves at the time but very pleased that you’re all moving in the right direction towards where you want to be!

I’m a straight white male so can’t begin to understand the difficulties you’ve had to face. I’m also not sure I’ve ever actually met a trans person in real life. Met a couple of non-binary folk which I don’t really understand the mindset but don’t have an issue with and hope that is evident in conversations. People are people. Good people are good people.

Well you've met us online, and we're happy to answer any trans questions you have. We're just plain old people on a journey to be what we should have been from the start. Not sure if I qualify as good, but definitely a people.

Boo. Hopefully nothing too major outside of the inconvenience of having to go to begin with, and you feel better when you climb out of bed today!

Still not feeling great, but at least treated

Indeed! And if you have any experience with MMOs, for example, it's a similar sort of phenomenon: An otherwise outsized number of LGBT+ folk, lots of neurodivergent people all across the spectrum, and - maybe surprisingly, given the stereotypes - tons and tons of (cis) women.

The effect is probably greatly diminished in the post-MMO/Live Service/Games as a Service model, but yeah.

Lies! Girls don't play games! 'member?

 

[shortkut]

Lies! Girls don't play games! 'member?

[sarcasm]I think they are allowed if they post pictures, but even then, they’re obviously bad at games because their breasts get in the way


[/sarcasm]

 

[Mark]

[sarcasm]I think they are allowed if they post pictures, but even then, they’re obviously bad at games because their breasts get in the way

View attachment 2379
[/sarcasm]

 

[Crystal]

[sarcasm]I think they are allowed if they post pictures, but even then, they’re obviously bad at games because their breasts get in the way

View attachment 2379
[/sarcasm]

Can confirm they do get in the way, but I have that biological advantage everyone talks about, so I only half suck at games.

 

[Raine]

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