Zell Wolf GWF Wolf - Zell's Version Night + Day 1

[Zell 17]

okay, fine. I made a mistake, there's a ton of roles and I will admit I didn't flat out read them all yet. (I figured I'd read them as things like this came up)

I was mistaken and I apologize.

BUT, I guess this requires more rule clarification.

@Zell 17 does "same team" mean wolves vs townies? or does it mean good vs evil vs unknown.

HYPOTHETICALLY if ants is the doctir and I'm the witch, would we read same team or not?

There are four teams:

Wolves, Town, Fool, Serial Killer. If two people are on the same team then they belong to the same group.

“Good” “Evil” and “Unknown” apply to the aura seer.

 

[Fool's Requiem]

I don't understand why people would blab their roles to everyone and why anyone would believe them.

 

[Tubby23]

They've also blown their big super weapon on two minor roles. They don't have the Doctor. They don't have the Sheriff. They don't have the Medium, who may be the single most powerful entity in this entire game. They don't have the Aura Seer. They have to deal with an unknown protector role. Honestly, their best strategy would be to convince the town they're vulnerable townies and keep me around wasting my protection on them. Since I can't be killed in a single night unless they waste that ability, I'd be more of an asset for them to keep around, assuming they can convince me one of them is worth protecting.

I'm not sure if I'm confused or looking to deeply into something but the Sheriff isn't a guaranteed role... It's one of the three handed out at random.

Either a) you're the Sheriff, b) you're aware of who the Sheriff may be, or c) simple misunderstanding

 

[Ryan!]

I'm not sure if I'm confused or looking to deeply into something but the Sheriff isn't a guaranteed role... It's one of the three handed out at random.

Either a) you're the Sheriff, b) you're aware of who the Sheriff may be, or c) simple misunderstanding

Misunderstanding. I meant Detective.

 

[shortkut]

Misunderstanding. I meant Detective.

As the detective, I can tell you this skill is useless without a baseline to compare people to

 

[Fool's Requiem]

As the detective, I can tell you this skill is useless without a baseline

Detective in Amogus is generally useless, too. I don't get why they can't make Detective a cool role.

 

[Ryan!]

If you can investigate yourself (and I see no reason you can't) you can easily expand your knowledge base handily. Person X is same team as you. They must be townie. Person Y isn't same team as Person X. They are either an independent or a wolf. Person Z is same as Person Y. You have confirmed a townie and two wolves in three days.

 

[shortkut]

If you can investigate yourself (and I see no reason you can't) you can easily expand your knowledge base handily. Person X is same team as you. They must be townie. Person Y isn't same team as Person X. They are either an independent or a wolf. Person Z is same as Person Y. You have confirmed a townie and two wolves in three days.

@Zell 17 being a butthead is why I can’t investigate myself

 

[Ryan!]

@Zell 17 being a butthead is why I can’t investigate myself

Oh. Well I guess just investigate Cole and myself. Prove we are who we say we are.

 

[shortkut]

I also cannot investigate people who have died, so I’m a detective who cannot investigate a murder (mob or supernatural in nature)

 

[Cole]

One hitch in your plan:

Berserk werewolf: Once per game, can select any villager for a guaranteed night kill. Anyone attempting to protect that player will also die.

plot twist. thanks for sharing with the class.

There are four teams:

Wolves, Town, Fool, Serial Killer. If two people are on the same team then they belong to the same group.

“Good” “Evil” and “Unknown” apply to the aura seer.

oh, okay thst makes it easy.

if shortkut is right, which I believe him right now. then I am here to 100% guarantee that Ants is either serial killer, wolf, or fool.

I will be killing him this evening. it's literally a straight win. either a wolf is dead, the serial killer is dead, the fool is dead safely at night, or shortkut lied.

whether I die or not tomorrow, if ants is dead and revealed as anything OTHER than one of those 3 roles.

shortkut is a liar and please lynch him.

I don't understand why people would blab their roles to everyone and why anyone would believe them.

see above for the reason we put ourselves.

assuming shortkut is dead. tonight I will eliminate a threat for the town.

good work team.

 

[shortkut]

plot twist. thanks for sharing with the class.

oh, okay thst makes it easy.

if shortkut is right, which I believe him right now. then I am here to 100% guarantee that Ants is either serial killer, wolf, or fool.

I will be killing him this evening. it's literally a straight win. either a wolf is dead, the serial killer is dead, the fool is dead safely at night, or shortkut lied.

whether I die or not tomorrow, if ants is dead and revealed as anything OTHER than one of those 3 roles.

shortkut is a liar and please lynch him.

see above for the reason we put ourselves.

assuming shortkut is dead. tonight I will eliminate a threat for the town.

good work team.

The wolves should leave you alive tonight because the serial killer is a threat to them

 

[Cole]

The wolves should leave you alive tonight because the serial killer is a threat to them

unless ants is a wolf in which case they might try to beat me to killing me. but yes, both the fool and the serial killer are a threat to them

so leaving me alive to put him down is a win. but if he's a wolf, then , they need to take me out

 

[shortkut]

unless ants is a wolf in which case they might try to beat me to killing me. but yes, both the fool and the serial killer are a threat to them

so leaving me alive to put him down is a win. but if he's a wolf, then , they need to take me out

If ants is alive tomorrow he gets lynched. Twice I wanted to vote ants day 1, twice I was right he was a wolf

 

[Zell 17]

Here’s a few more rules I guess:

In general, you cannot use any actions against yourself. The gunner cannot shoot themself. The wolves cannot vote themselves at night. The townies cannot vote to lynch themselves. The doctor cannot protect themselves, etc.

The exceptions are called out specifically in the role descriptions. The bodyguard and tough guy automatically protect themselves whether they want to or not. The beast hunter (if they are in the game) may place their trap on themselves.

 

[Cole]

If ants is alive tomorrow he gets lynched. Twice I wanted to vote ants day 1, twice I was right he was a wolf

oh come off it. you can't use two admittedly joke votes as evidence you were right.

(it will hysterically prove ryans probability theory wrong)

but yes. if ants is alive tomorrow, lynch him

if ants is a townie. lynch shortkut

 

[Cole]

Here’s a few more rules I guess:

In general, you cannot use any actions against yourself. The gunner cannot shoot themself. The wolves cannot vote themselves at night. The townies cannot vote to lynch themselves. The doctor cannot protect themselves, etc.

The exceptions are called out specifically in the role descriptions. The bodyguard and tough guy automatically protect themselves whether they want to or not. The beast hunter (if they are in the game) may place their trap on themselves.

for the future: I do think this is silly. if an investigator wants to investigate themselves, it's often a waste, so who cares?

protecting one's self is a HUGE part of protector strategy.

but you do you boo.

 

[shortkut]

oh come off it. you can't use two admittedly joke votes as evidence you were right.

(it will hysterically prove ryans probability theory wrong)

but yes. if ants is alive tomorrow, lynch him

if ants is a townie. lynch shortkut

If ants is a townie, lynch Cole. If ants and Cole are townies, stop playing the game because @Zell 17 would have fucked up

 

[Zell 17]

for the future: I do think this is silly. if an investigator wants to investigate themselves, it's often a waste, so who cares?

protecting one's self is a HUGE part of protector strategy.

but you do you boo.

It makes these villager roles too powerful. Doctors being able to protect themselves makes the game unwinnable in certain circumstances, such as with the serial killer and doctor remaining.

The doctor not being able to protect themself is offset by the fact that unlike other protector roles, they get unlimited use of the protection ability.

 

[Ryan!]

unless ants is a wolf in which case they might try to beat me to killing me. but yes, both the fool and the serial killer are a threat to them

so leaving me alive to put him down is a win. but if he's a wolf, then , they need to take me out

And we know that won't be happening. Unless they're, again, fine with wasting their superweapon on you to also get me, having one of their identities revealed, leaving the Doctor still around to also protect someone else (kut makes the most sense here), and then having the Medium able to bring one of us back, and on top of all that having to deal with the Fool and the Serial Killer, which is a lot easier for you to deal with than them. The simple fact is if both Cole and I are dead after the night phase, as he said, Ants! is very likely to be a wolf. I'm inclined to believe kut is actually telling the truth here and that he's the Detective.

 

[Ryan!]

If ants is alive tomorrow he gets lynched. Twice I wanted to vote ants day 1, twice I was right he was a wolf

I'm actually fine with this strategy. And if kut ends up lying (I don't think he is), we'll know who to lynch the day after.

 

[Cole]

yeah, because of the role reveals, if we work on the assumption that everyone's being honest, we have a bad guy off the board, and/or a free lynch tomorrow.

 

[Ryan!]

yeah, because of the role reveals, if we work on the assumption that everyone's being honest, we have a bad guy off the board, and/or a free lynch tomorrow.

I'm the douche bag at the table that let's you know I made my flush draw from the open end straight flush draw and you should fold after put in 2/3 pot bet.

 

[Cole]

I'm the douche bag at the table that let's you know I made my flush draw from the open end straight flush draw and you should fold after put in 2/3 pot bet.

I mean, anyone who's played a lot of poker with me knows my favorite strategy is to tell people what I'm doing.

 

[Cole]

it's not my fault no one ever believes me

 

[Fool's Requiem]

trust no one

 

[Dean]

Holy shit. I traveled back from Indiana today, hence the silence. Just got caught up. You guys talk a shit ton.

What I've gathered so far...

Cole is claiming he's a witch. At first says he's going to protect himself. Now says he can't (confirmed by Zell)
Ryan is claiming he's a bodyguard. Says it takes the wolves two attempts to kill him. Vash pointed out the Berserker Wolf, who can kill him in one shot.
shortkut is claiming he's a detective and that Ants! and Cole are not on the same team. Assuming Cole is indeed a witch, that means Ants! is not a townie (?)
Ants! could be the Fool, judging by what everyone has said.

Cole and Kat also had a nice discussion over what "almost never lying" means, and Cole and Ryan spent way too much time arguing over odds/probability.

Tommy wants us to vote for someone. Cole does not.

Hopefully I didn't miss anything too significant. I started skimming several posts during some of the redundant arguments.

 

[Cole]

Holy shit. I traveled back from Indiana today, hence the silence. Just got caught up. You guys talk a shit ton.

What I've gathered so far...

Cole is claiming he's a witch. At first says he's going to protect himself. Now says he can't (confirmed by Zell)
Ryan is claiming he's a bodyguard. Says it takes the wolves two attempts to kill him. Vash pointed out the Berserker Wolf, who can kill him in one shot.
shortkut is claiming he's a detective and that Ants! and Cole are not on the same team. Assuming Cole is indeed a witch, that means Ants! is not a townie (?)
Ants! could be the Fool, judging by what everyone has said.

Cole and Kat also had a nice discussion over what "almost never lying" means, and Cole and Ryan spent way too much time arguing over odds/probability.

Tommy wants us to vote for someone. Cole does not.

Hopefully I didn't miss anything too significant. I started skimming several posts during some of the redundant arguments.

this a pretty good tldr

 

[Tubby23]

If Ants! is a wolf who else is getting tacked on with him? Because if I read right we can kill two wolves tomorrow with a lynching and The Priest

 

[Cole]

If Ants! is a wolf who else is getting tacked on with him? Because if I read right we can kill two wolves tomorrow with a lynching and The Priest

my leading suspects after ants are Tommy and Fool.

 

[Ants!]

Why not use the Aura Seer to read one of us? Coleman could be lying, or one of us could be a neutral role, or I could be a wolf. The detective power is so limited, and either one of us could be the fool at this point.

This would mean the Aura Seer outs themselves, but then we have protector roles for that.

 

[Cole]

Why not use the Aura Seer to read one of us? Coleman could be lying, or one of us could be a neutral role, or I could be a wolf. The detective power is so limited, and either one of us could be the fool at this point.

This would mean the Aura Seer outs themselves, but then we have protector roles for that.

or I can just kill you and the rest solves itself.

at this stage, it doesn't matter if I'm lying, it just matters if shortkut is. if shortkut is lying, we'll know when you're dead and we get a wolf lynched.

but nice if you to try and get ANOTHER role to out themselves.

care to explain thst?

 

[Dean]

I think if Cole were the Fool, he wouldn't have been so convincing in telling everyone he is the witch, unless he's playing some convoluted long game (which I wouldn't put past him... Cole is crazy in these games)

 

[Cole]

I think if Cole were the Fool, he wouldn't have been so convincing in telling everyone he is the witch, unless he's playing some convoluted long game (which I wouldn't put past him... Cole is crazy in these games)

I WISH I were the fool. that would be so much fun.

 

[Dean]

I really don't know what to do. I guess I will Abstain for right now. We've got 36 hours.

Did Zell confirm why we started at 5 pm ET? I must've misread it as 9 pm ET and not GMT?

 

[Fool's Requiem]

I WISH I were the fool. that would be so much fun.

Samesies. I also wish I was the fool, ha ha.

 

[Cole]

I really don't know what to do. I guess I will Abstain for right now. We've got 36 hours.

Did Zell confirm why we started at 5 pm ET? I must've misread it as 9 pm ET and not GMT?

yeah, I know what the OP said

but @Zell 17 can you tell us the time day 1 ends and the time night 2 ends please?

 

[Ants!]

or I can just kill you and the rest solves itself.

at this stage, it doesn't matter if I'm lying, it just matters if shortkut is. if shortkut is lying, we'll know when you're dead and we get a wolf lynched.

but nice if you to try and get ANOTHER role to out themselves.

care to explain thst?

Because then doctors and witches know who to protect, and it will be useful to know someone’s aura before lynching them. If it says unknown, don’t do it. If it says evil, go for it.

Read me or Cole and let us know what you find, that’s my suggestion.

 

[shortkut]

The alternative is we kill ants on day 1

 

[Ants!]

The alternative is we kill ants on day 1

Could say this is a foolish thing to do.

 

[Ants!]

But go for it if you like.

 

[shortkut]

Could say this is a foolish thing to do.

The buzzword you slipped in there is the reason why you’re being killed at night

 

[Ants!]

The buzzword you slipped in there is the reason why you’re being killed at night

You have a night-killing role, eh? Thought you were detective.

 

[shortkut]

You have a night-killing role, eh? Thought you were detective.

Reading is fundamental

 

[Kat]

Here’s a few more rules I guess:

In general, you cannot use any actions against yourself. The gunner cannot shoot themself. The wolves cannot vote themselves at night. The townies cannot vote to lynch themselves. The doctor cannot protect themselves, etc.

The exceptions are called out specifically in the role descriptions. The bodyguard and tough guy automatically protect themselves whether they want to or not. The beast hunter (if they are in the game) may place their trap on themselves.

I have some more questions about roles after reading them again (warning, pedantic programmer side coming out):
It says the witch's potions are consumed on use. Cole is interpreting that to mean the protection potion isn't consumed unless the person being protected is attacked. I feel like it could also be read that drinking the potion at all would qualify as "using" it. Which is it?

For all the roles that can protect others and automatically protect themselves, does that mean if they get attacked, they quit protecting the other player, or they save themselves AND the other player? If they already saved someone, do they still protect themselves? It wouldn't matter for just wolves, but with the serial killer, it could come into play. I guess more generally, what does "protects themselves" mean exactly? How can they die if they can save players and automatically protect themselves (besides lynching, I guess)? Does the wolf berserker ability count as one attack for the bodyguard or does he die from it?

Ryan, if I'm reading this correctly, the bodyguard DOES NOT get told who attacked them. That's only the tough guy. The bodyguard gets to live through an extra attack instead.

For the order of night actions mattering: do we have to wait until the night phase starts to officially declare our night actions? If not, how far in advance can we declare them? If someone tries to do an action that's impossible (like they're trying to protect someone who is already dead), what happens? (Night starts at 6 am my time and I'm not a morning person at all, rip.)

Some roles (like detective) don't specify what phase their action takes place. Should we assume always night or can some use those during the day?

 

[Cole]

Because then doctors and witches know who to protect, and it will be useful to know someone’s aura before lynching them. If it says unknown, don’t do it. If it says evil, go for it.

Read me or Cole and let us know what you find, that’s my suggestion.

maybe you only skimmed the thread, but this literally matters to the sum of zero.

I believe shortkut is the detective, and I 100% believe I would have been half of his investigation just because it's me. and for a night 0 investigation, why wouldn't he go for the guy he plans to jokingly vote for. I believe him.

which means you are not on my team.

which means I am 100% certain you are wolf, serial killer, or fool.

I'm killing you tonight unless someone manages to stop me, but LITERALLY ANY protector in this game that chooses to protect Ants tonight has no idea what they are doing in this game. this is a win/win. if Ants dies and is a townie, shortkut lied to us and you lynch him. if Ants doesn't die, someone either got to me first (which I hope to not let happen), or a townie protector doesn't trust me and saves you anyway.

You have a night-killing role, eh? Thought you were detective.

he's referring to me saying I'm gonna kill you and you know it.

shortkut knows my game better than most in this thread. he is probably more confident than he has let on that I'm telling the truth. which means HE is telling the truth. which means he knows you're drinking my potion of death this evening.

 

[Ants!]

Checkmate. I have no defense. Kill me.

 

[Cole]

I have some more questions about roles after reading them again (warning, pedantic programmer side coming out):
It says the witch's potions are consumed on use. Cole is interpreting that to mean the protection potion isn't consumed unless the person being protected is attacked. I feel like it could also be read that drinking the potion at all would qualify as "using" it. Which is it?

I can answer this definitively but you can of course wait for his confirmation, because why would you trust me?

in my dm from zell telling me my role it reads "One can be used to protect any player. It is consumed if the protection is successful."

 

[Cole]

I reread Zells night 0 post.

we have all of Sunday to talk this out. I can't do it right now, but here is my official request thst we can decipher whether or not it's worth it to risk lynching Ants.

is he a galaxy brain and this is all a fools run?

or is it less complicated than that and he's just a wolf or serial killer?

I'm gonna do a little rereading tomorrow and see if we can't suss this out. but with so much time left and unlimited vote changes, maybe we can get ants lynched, and then gain a day on the wolves.

 

[Ryan!]

Ants!, we've all been straightforward thus far. What's your role?