Breaking Satellite Images Show 30% of Gaza Destroyed

[Mark]

The dude is African. I find it hard to believe Africans are hard at work building the white man’s utopia.

There’s a lot of fucked up shit going on in Israel but this is not a Black-White race issue like we see in the United States. It just isn’t.

Which, let’s be real, it isn’t even a black-white race issue here anymore. There are way too many nuances to even consider it as simple as the color of skin. Sure, that might be the case in some places still, but there are tiers to that bullshit everywhere else.

From what I’ve learned, there’s an increasing amount of right wing talk across the Atlantic regarding immigration and refugee/asylum seekers… even countries like Ireland are contending with an influx of migrants. Knowing that, I can only imagine the similarities to some of the rhetoric we hear over here about the southern border.

 

[Leandros?]

Which, let’s be real, it isn’t even a black-white race issue here anymore. There are way too many nuances to even consider it as simple as the color of skin. Sure, that might be the case in some places still, but there are tiers to that bullshit everywhere else.

From what I’ve learned, there’s an increasing amount of right wing talk across the Atlantic regarding immigration and refugee/asylum seekers… even countries like Ireland are contending with an influx of migrants. Knowing that, I can only imagine the similarities to some of the rhetoric we hear over here about the southern border.

Sure, except it happened 12 years ago, before the massive migrant fluxes, caused by power vacuums after the west fucked up North Africa and the Middle East, were picking up steam.

 

[Leandros?]

Of course Israel cares, they need billions in US tax money to be economically viable and to prosecute this war. Otherwise why would they bring out all these ridiculous English languages videos of supposed headquarters underneath hospitals? Biden is a psychotic whose support is generally unwavering but even he wants to be re-elected, and I think the white house signaling a desire to end the conflict quickly is partly because he wants to keep it away from voter attention as November draws closer.

PR has always been a component of Israeli self defense, because they cannot exist independently and are constantly doing horrendous shit to the people they're oppressing.

Following up on this because I couldn't find the video before:

 

[Mark]

Following up on this because I couldn't find the video before:

See, this reminds me of that saying about how if you’re confident, you don’t have to tell people you’re confident, or if you’re tough, you don’t have to tell people you’re tough, or however it went. I understand advocating for causes, but if you have to actively encourage or remind people to perform acts to support a cause, what does that say? Sure, the same argument can be made about soliciting donations for the Salvation Army or for Feed The Children or whatever other charity, but when we’re talking about a whole nation of people? Maybe I’m cynical, but that just comes off the wrong way to me. You shouldn’t need to actively recruit people to speak for your cause if it’s just.

 

[Fire Queen]

re: the assertion that africans are not at work building "the white man's utopia," i don't think you're going to find a futuristic jetsons-ass segregated city built on the backs of slave labor. but that is also not the way anyone should be thinking about that. is there a "utopia"? no. does labor and suffering in the global south directly lead to improvements and advancements in western society writ large? yes. absolutely.

here's just one example, and part of the reason why i've largely personally stopped using generative AI:

‘It’s destroyed me completely’: Kenyan moderators decry toll of training of AI models

Employees describe the psychological trauma of reading and viewing graphic content, low pay and abrupt dismissals

www.theguardian.com

 

[Zell 17]

re: the assertion that africans are not at work building "the white man's utopia," i don't think you're going to find a futuristic jetsons-ass segregated city built on the backs of slave labor. but that is also not the way anyone should be thinking about that. is there a "utopia"? no. does labor and suffering in the global south directly lead to improvements and advancements in western society writ large? yes. absolutely.

here's just one example, and part of the reason why i've largely personally stopped using generative AI:

‘It’s destroyed me completely’: Kenyan moderators decry toll of training of AI models

Employees describe the psychological trauma of reading and viewing graphic content, low pay and abrupt dismissals

www.theguardian.com

What do you want them to do? AI is a whole 'nother can of worms, but this company looks like they did content moderation primarily for Facebook prior to AI. When Facebook began, there was very little content moderation. Then people posted a bunch of evil shit, and everyone said "Facebook needs to moderate content! We can't have kiddie porn and gore videos all over the news feed!" which sounds pretty reasonable.

Then, people found that Facebook was doing a pretty good job of moderating content in white countries, but they were abysmal in non-English speaking countries. Here's a whole John Oliver segment crushing them for not hiring anyone overseas to do their content moderation:


So now in response we have people overseas who naturally speak the language doing the content moderation. And the conclusion we are taking from that is Facebook is ruining these people by forcing them to do content moderation? Repeating the first point, what the hell do you want Facebook to do?

 

[Fire Queen]

pay them a wage commiserate with what they are being asked to do? provide accessible therapeutic and counseling services for workers exposed to traumatic images and/or content? ask questions such as "if building this tool requires exposing hundreds and even thousands of people to a constant stream of disturbing images and writing, is this tool worth building?"? like idk about anyone else but if not having access to funy ai images means that people halfway around the world i'll never meet will suffer less, i think that's a pretty easy tradeoff

edit: more reading regarding the working conditions

Exclusive: The $2 Per Hour Workers Who Made ChatGPT Safer

A TIME investigation reveals the difficult conditions faced by the workers who made ChatGPT possible

time.com

 

[Mark]

pay them a wage commiserate with what they are being asked to do? provide accessible therapeutic and counseling services for workers exposed to traumatic images and/or content? ask questions such as "if building this tool requires exposing hundreds and even thousands of people to a constant stream of disturbing images and writing, is this tool worth building?"? like idk about anyone else but if not having access to funy ai images means that people halfway around the world i'll never meet will suffer less, i think that's a pretty easy tradeoff

edit: more reading regarding the working conditions

Exclusive: The $2 Per Hour Workers Who Made ChatGPT Safer

A TIME investigation reveals the difficult conditions faced by the workers who made ChatGPT possible

time.com

I can agree with this. Content moderation has to be a serious affair on that kind of scale. I remember some of the shit that I had to moderate back in the early days, and I couldn’t imagine seeing what comes through on a scale like that.

However, education needs to be on the forefront of this discussion. You have to let these people know from the jump what kind of shit they’re going to see. Put them through the paces before you turn them loose on a computer on their own managing content. It’s okay to pay a wage suitable for what they’re being asked to do, but they need to know ahead of time what that will entail… and I don’t think it is, otherwise, those thin-skinned people would be less likely to make it past the applicant stage.

 

[Leandros?]

re: the assertion that africans are not at work building "the white man's utopia," i don't think you're going to find a futuristic jetsons-ass segregated city built on the backs of slave labor.

The middle east is littered with megalomaniacal building projects built by poor people robbed of their passport, with many dying, that are inaccessible to them.

 

[Fire Queen]

The middle east is littered with megalomaniacal building projects built by poor people robbed of their passport, with many dying, that are inaccessible to them.

oh yeah, one look at the 2022 world cup confirms that. maybe a better way to phrase my thought is the utopias built on slave labor are done in ways that do not resemble the american definition and idea of chattel slavery and therefore do not register in the minds of most western citizens

 

[Zell 17]

"if building this tool requires exposing hundreds and even thousands of people to a constant stream of disturbing images and writing, is this tool worth building?"?

This statement would make the entire Internet unviable.

 

[Leandros?]

Returning to the topic:
Israeli psychopaths have been blocking aid from crossing into Gaza, including by hosting an awful goa trance party. These blockades are coordinated by zealous youth sleeping in identical entirely new tents which I'm sure is indicative that this is their first outing and not something coordinated with money and political power. But they're totally from all sides of the political spectrum!

Just look at these cuties smiling while blocking critical food and medication to 2 million people their country is slowly smothering out of existence:


Work is still being done on disproving the obviously false claims that a Palestinian rocket fell on Al-Ahli hospital, even though that attack pales in comparison to what has been done to other hospitals since, such as sniping nurses through windows, dressing armed people up as healthcare workers in a poor attempt at disguise to murder paralysed Palestinians in hospital beds, tank shelling the building, bulldozing them, and collapsing their function altogether through combinations of these, you know, the type of stuff that is demonstrably worse than an air-dropped bomb that could be called a stray?

Right now all eyes are on the unfolding massacres in Rafah, where women and children are being randomly shot while waiting for food Israel is blocking. A couple weeks back, hexacopters armed with rifles had shot up a food line.

Israel has been creeping their bombardments of Lebanon ever more northwards towards Beirut and Lebanon seem powerless to prevent it due to a lack of air defense. The US would promptly attack in case they did, so perhaps they are only willing to use it in an all-or-nothing scenario if they have received some from Iran or Russia. In retaliation, Hezbollah have been targeting northern cities with ever larger bombardments (Hezbollah's arsenal dwarfs Hamas' in quantity and warhead size). This has caused a swath of the north to be evacuated, and to be housed in hotels across the country, which has been causing trouble of its own, with people evacuated around Gaza and them having to share overbooked rooms.
Over half a million Israelis with dual passports (the type that comes for a free house already stocked with food, though unfortunately with Arab text on it) have left the country, the economy is down 5% in a quarter, AnsarAllah are ramping up the damage to UK/US/Israeli/AIS-silent ships and seemingly have submarine drone capabilities to enforce their blockade, as well as AA to take down UAVs; they've yesterday both sunk the RUBYMAR and downed a Reaper drone.

All the while, western aid seems essentially unwavering, though perhaps ICJ cases might motivate some. I doubt it because liberals believe in nothing and so they can just handwave away such verdicts, but we'll see.

 

[Raine]

Spoiler: Not familiar with this organization, but...

This would also play into the above and the previously posted, completely unhinged woman.

Semafor (website) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Mark]

Spoiler: Not familiar with this organization, but...

This would also play into the above and the previously posted, completely unhinged woman.

Semafor (website) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I’ve known a lot of combat vets in my time. One of my best friends was a veteran of both the Afghanistan and Iraq campaigns. Some of the shit I see in this video is 100% sociopathic, and goes against everything I’ve heard from American soldiers who’ve had to engage people. It’s not supposed to be a pleasurable experience like some of those people depict… it’s war. The fact that these individuals seem to be enjoying themselves… phew.

 

[Fire Queen]

it's way easier to have fun in a warzone when you genuinely believe the people you are massacring are closer to animals than people and that is the IOF working as intended

 

[Leandros?]

That, plus a lot of them are basically children doing military service after high school, and others are reservists who have done just that military service a long time ago. Pluuus, the IDF is an absolute shambles of a military organisation. They have no standards or discipline. Their required daily PT is 15 minutes, their sanitary discipline is dogshit, as evidenced by the constant outbreaks of dysentery and other hygiene-related disease. Their camps are built with no guidelines, they use plastic chairs and party tents. It's all a charade and an outlet for losing that feeling of invincibility they've been told they had their entire life.

 

[Zell 17]

That, plus a lot of them are basically children doing military service after high school, and others are reservists who have done just that military service a long time ago. Pluuus, the IDF is an absolute shambles of a military organisation. They have no standards or discipline. Their required daily PT is 15 minutes, their sanitary discipline is dogshit, as evidenced by the constant outbreaks of dysentery and other hygiene-related disease. Their camps are built with no guidelines, they use plastic chairs and party tents. It's all a charade and an outlet for losing that feeling of invincibility they've been told they had their entire life.

Hard to disagree with that. Much of this conflict has really pierced the veil of indestructibility that Israel has had, starting obviously with October 7 and how miserably the security services failed. I'm guessing a lot of the current destruction is a form of lashing out to try to regain their former appearance of strength. "See? Look at what we destroyed! See how super strong we are!"

 

[VashTheStampede]

Uhhhhhhh

Did nobody proofread this statement???

 

[Mark]

Uhhhhhhh

Did nobody proofread this statement???

Nooope. Not one bit. Just pushed it on through. Wow.

 

[Leandros?]

Uhhhhhhh

Did nobody proofread this statement???

They did

 

[Leandros?]

libs.txt

 

[Advocate for Ants! Mouth]

Oh man straight for the "Pro-Palestinians not being murdered being equated with not feeling horrible about others who have been murdered" view there.

It's 100% propaganda, the question would be if that was her intent/if she were asked to create it by a government entity.

 

[Mark]

It's 100% propaganda, the question would be if that was her intent/if she were asked to create it by a government entity.

Which is a good question that can be raised about a large chunk of these instances, because propaganda isn’t just leaflets falling from the sky like it used to be… kids are indoctrinated into the shit at grade school level so they never know the difference.

 

[Leandros?]

Pictured: the artist and her art. Just whiteness all around. Shitty Israelis generally will call themselves white if it suits their argument of being superior to others, but they're still different from whites if it suits them!! That's not to say there isn't a whole lot of intra-Israeli racism; Ashkenazim (former Eastern European Jews) are regarded as the best off financially and politically and Sephardi and Mizrahi are frowned upon. Ethiopian Jews, well you know, they exist.

 

[Fire Queen]

the puma shirt

 

[Advocate for Ants! Mouth]

View attachment 9765
Pictured: the artist and her art. Just whiteness all around. Shitty Israelis generally will call themselves white if it suits their argument of being superior to others, but they're still different from whites if it suits them!! That's not to say there isn't a whole lot of intra-Israeli racism; Ashkenazim (former Eastern European Jews) are regarded as the best off financially and politically and Sephardi and Mizrahi are frowned upon. Ethiopian Jews, well you know, they exist.

Wait, THIS is the art that depicts the attacks and where she wants people to feel compassion? Armed soldiers crying?

I'd understand it more if it were art depicting the festival somehow, or involved civilians who were there in some form.

 

[Fire Queen]

oh my god i looked into her and she wasn't even born in israel, she was born in soviet-era ukraine. also for what it's worth some of her art does depict that festival

not the most graceful depiction, and also not somehting i would personally choose to depict in such a fashion, but

 

[Advocate for Ants! Mouth]

So everyone who was at the festival was a white woman? The only people who are crying in the art are white women?

Israel has people of color. Also men.

 

[Mark]

So everyone who was at the festival was a white woman? The only people who are crying in the art are white women?

Israel has people of color. Also men.

Yeah, but this reminds me of that newish trend we’ve seen with artists being unable to create art without inserting themselves into it. It’s authentic to her because it depicts someone like her as the subject.

 

[Leandros?]

So yesterday an active duty airman doused himself in gasoline in front of the Israeli embassy in DC and the major liberal news vendors that are even covering it are either fully not reporting that he said he didn't want to be complicit in a genocide and that Palestine should be free, sneakily editing it in later or just leaving it out of the headline. Hell, the only one that did was Fox news and they clearly have ulterior motives for doing it. Love those trustworthy neutral news outlets!


The embassy security guard that saw it happen had his gun trained on him until he collapsed.

 

[Advocate for Ants! Mouth]

So yesterday an active duty airman doused himself in gasoline in front of the Israeli embassy in DC and the major liberal news vendors that are even covering it are either fully not reporting that he said he didn't want to be complicit in a genocide and that Palestine should be free, sneakily editing it in later or just leaving it out of the headline. Hell, the only one that did was Fox news and they clearly have ulterior motives for doing it. Love those trustworthy neutral news outlets!


The embassy security guard that saw it happen had his gun trained on him until he collapsed.

There are videos of this online, blurred out in some instances. You can hear him shouting the whole time (literally the only thing he says while on fire is "free Palestine" over and over). I wouldn't recommend watching if you at all feel like you would struggle with it.

But yes, the guard came over and had the gun on him the whole time while other people ran over with fire extinguishers. Even after he collapsed he kept the gun on him for a bit.

This was a 25 year old man who started it by saying he was going to do this and it pales in comparison to what the people in Gaza are going through.

 

[aiat_gamer]

As someone from Iran, I think my take will sound very right-wingy. But from what I can tell, for better or worse, majority of the Iranians are fully in support of Israel. We have way too much bad experience with extreme relegious regimes to have any empathy for Gaza. I know how it sounds, but as far as I can tell people of Gaza are mostly in full support of Hamas. I dont know why they are referred to as being Palestinians since they do not fall under the rule of Palestine government and chose Hamas as the ruler.

 

[Smacktard]

But from what I can tell, for better or worse, majority of the Iranians are fully in support of Israel.

This is not a take I was expecting at all.

 

[shortkut]

This is not a take I was expecting at all.

Same here. I would have assumed they would hope both sides destroy each other completely

 

[Smacktard]

Same here. I would have assumed they would hope both sides destroy each other completely

I thought Israel hated Iran and vice-versa.

 

[Mark]

There are videos of this online, blurred out in some instances. You can hear him shouting the whole time (literally the only thing he says while on fire is "free Palestine" over and over). I wouldn't recommend watching if you at all feel like you would struggle with it.

But yes, the guard came over and had the gun on him the whole time while other people ran over with fire extinguishers. Even after he collapsed he kept the gun on him for a bit.

This was a 25 year old man who started it by saying he was going to do this and it pales in comparison to what the people in Gaza are going through.

Yeah, I don’t recommend searching out the unedited videos if you’re sensitive to that kind of material. It’ll linger with you.

Self-immolation is a hardcore statement suicide for sure, so I obviously wonder about the individual’s mental health leading up to it, but, damn… I sympathize with the witnesses, especially the ones close enough to see it and smell it. That smell of burning flesh will haunt them.

This is not a take I was expecting at all.

Same here. I would have assumed they would hope both sides destroy each other completely

Think of it like office or high school politics. He said/she said bullshit, and then when you actually get to a source… there’s a totally different perspective than the one you thought you’d hear. It makes sense with the propaganda wars we see that people would be led to believe others from other countries feel a certain way, because it reaffirms the mob mentality that is politics. It’s easier for you or I to believe X if we’re under the impression that citizens of country Y and Z also subscribe to the same beliefs. Especially when there are examples to support it.

 

[Advocate for Ants! Mouth]

I dont know why they are referred to as being Palestinians since they do not fall under the rule of Palestine government and chose Hamas as the ruler.

Did the people of France stop being French when they had all of their various revolutions?

 

[Leandros?]

As someone from Iran, I think my take will sound very right-wingy. But from what I can tell, for better or worse, majority of the Iranians are fully in support of Israel. We have way too much bad experience with extreme relegious regimes to have any empathy for Gaza. I know how it sounds, but as far as I can tell people of Gaza are mostly in full support of Hamas. I dont know why they are referred to as being Palestinians since they do not fall under the rule of Palestine government and chose Hamas as the ruler.

Yeah I don't buy this. Are you in Iran or are you in the Iranian diaspora that left Iran after the revolution? Because while Iran's citizens are fed up with their government, they do not support Israel because of it. Diaspora....well just look at the Cuban community in Florida. Or the Whites that left after the Russian revolution.

 

[aiat_gamer]

I thought Israel hated Iran and vice-versa.

That is the issue, the regime of Iran is very different from how actual Iranians feel and believe. I know it is extreme, but as far as Iranians are concerned Israel should pretty much take control of the entire region. This is what living under an awful regime for so long does to you.

Yeah I don't buy this. Are you in Iran or are you in the Iranian diaspora that left Iran after the revolution? Because while Iran's citizens are fed up with their government, they do not support Israel because of it.

I really don't care if you buy it or not. I wasnt even born when Iran went through the revolution. I completely expect this though, since pretty much most western idea of a country like Iran comes through the warped filter of the media. None of you guys really know what Iranians think, believe and how they are separated from the regime.

 

[Leandros?]

So you're in the diaspora?

 

[aiat_gamer]

So you're in the diaspora?

In a way most of Iranians are in diaspora. So yeah, I am. The reason I finally moved out when I was 28 was that I just could not take it anymore. After years of voting for a change, trying to make a change and seeing everything get awful year after year I had enough. I do regularly visit, and have regular contact with many Iranians.

 

[Fire Queen]

this is a very fascinating perspective, because iran is public enemy #1 based on what the israeli government and press says.

Israeli President Calls For Coalition Against Iran's 'Evil Empire'

Israeli president Isaac Herzog called on the international community on Thursday to create “a very strong coalition” against “an empire of evil emanating from Iran”.

www.iranintl.com

EDIT: was vetting this source and, uh, found this interesting little tidbit:

In 2024, it was revealed that the management of Iran International has been transferred from the Saudis to Israel.[5]

 

[Leandros?]

^^ I came across that website as well and it's UK based so probably heavily anti-Iran. A cursory look at their headlines seems to indicate it.
e: hahaha oh my

In a way most of Iranians are in diaspora. So yeah, I am. The reason I finally moved out when I was 28 was that I just could not take it anymore. After years of voting for a change, trying to make a change and seeing everything get awful year after year I had enough. I do regularly visit, and have regular contact with many Iranians.

I wouldn't say most Iranians are in the diaspora like at all, and neither would the statistics in this page:

Iranian diaspora - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I won't pretend to know your motivations but I can only conclude that you are in some bubble that is not representative of the Iranian popular opinion wrt Palestine. The vast majority of Iranian citizens support Palestine's struggle for independence, even though their hated government aligns with that. Claiming that many support Israel take control of the entire region is frankly so disconnected from that that I'm a bit baffled. Don't tell me you want the Shah back?

 

[aiat_gamer]

^^ I came across that website as well and it's UK based so probably heavily anti-Iran. A cursory look at their headlines seems to indicate it.
e: hahaha oh my


I wouldn't say most Iranians are in the diaspora like at all, and neither would the statistics in this page:

Iranian diaspora - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I won't pretend to know your motivations but I can only conclude that you are in some bubble that is not representative of the Iranian popular opinion wrt Palestine. The vast majority of Iranian citizens support Palestine's struggle for independence, even though their hated government aligns with that. Claiming that many support Israel take control of the entire region is frankly so disconnected from that that I'm a bit baffled. Don't tell me you want the Shah back?

I am pretty sure I have a better grip on what majority of Iranians think and believe than you my friend.

 

[Fire Queen]

went digging for something to back that up and found this from an american think tank:

Iranians Differ Widely with Their Leaders Over the War Between Israel and Hamas • Stimson Center

The Iranian government and public opinion has splintered over time, as domestic and foreign policy shift support between Israel and Palestine

www.stimson.org

EDIT: this comes from an anonymous author so it's probably worth taking with a grain of salt

also found this, which is less informative and more just kind of amusing:

Iranian Daytime Show Conducts Viewer Poll: 'Is It Time For The Cancerous Tumor That Is The Zionist Regime To Disappear From The Face Of The Earth?' Poll Lists Only Two Possible Answers: 'Yes' And 'Definitely'

Iranian TV host Maryam Ghasemi presented the results of a viewer poll taken on a Channel 1 (Iran) daytime show that aire...

www.memri.org

 

[Leandros?]

I am pretty sure I have a better grip on what majority of Iranians think and believe than you my friend.

I'm pretty sure you don't! I've spoken to both people abroad with family remaining and people in Iran and their feelings on the matter are that solidarity is with the Palestinians overwhelmingly. You are a highly educated person in a STEM field who was sufficiently in disagreement with the government that you left, having the means to do so and be granted a workers visa in the EU. That places you in a very specific demographic, one which is generally so anti-government that some prefer to put in power the successor to a despot lackey of the west. Not saying that's what you want, but like I said, diasporas of nations tend to not align with the home country.

went digging for something to back that up and found this from an american think tank:

Iranians Differ Widely with Their Leaders Over the War Between Israel and Hamas • Stimson Center

The Iranian government and public opinion has splintered over time, as domestic and foreign policy shift support between Israel and Palestine

www.stimson.org

EDIT: this comes from an anonymous author so it's probably worth taking with a grain of salt

It's thin at most. Besides that they're really using some non-evidence from social media to drive home his point that some anti-government people are so anti-government that they align with Israel.

also found this, which is less informative and more just kind of amusing:

Iranian Daytime Show Conducts Viewer Poll: 'Is It Time For The Cancerous Tumor That Is The Zionist Regime To Disappear From The Face Of The Earth?' Poll Lists Only Two Possible Answers: 'Yes' And 'Definitely'

Iranian TV host Maryam Ghasemi presented the results of a viewer poll taken on a Channel 1 (Iran) daytime show that aire...

www.memri.org

Memri is run by a former IDF officer. While there are some nutso religious programs on TV, they tend to blow it out of proportion with worst interpretation translations and outright lies.

 

[aiat_gamer]

went digging for something to back that up and found this from an american think tank:

Iranians Differ Widely with Their Leaders Over the War Between Israel and Hamas • Stimson Center

The Iranian government and public opinion has splintered over time, as domestic and foreign policy shift support between Israel and Palestine

www.stimson.org

EDIT: this comes from an anonymous author so it's probably worth taking with a grain of salt

also found this, which is less informative and more just kind of amusing:

Iranian Daytime Show Conducts Viewer Poll: 'Is It Time For The Cancerous Tumor That Is The Zionist Regime To Disappear From The Face Of The Earth?' Poll Lists Only Two Possible Answers: 'Yes' And 'Definitely'

Iranian TV host Maryam Ghasemi presented the results of a viewer poll taken on a Channel 1 (Iran) daytime show that aire...

www.memri.org

Eh, you don't need to dig much if you know what to look for. First of all, coming across official sources will be very hard since you know, the regime controls everything. But the participation estimate for the upcoming election is so low that even the regime cannot pretend everything is great.

I'm pretty sure you don't! I've spoken to both people abroad with family remaining and people in Iran and their feelings on the matter are that solidarity is with the Palestinians overwhelmingly. You are a highly educated person in a STEM field who was sufficiently in disagreement with the government that you left, having the means to do so and be granted a workers visa in the EU. That places you in a very specific demographic, one which is generally so anti-government that some prefer to put in power the successor to a despot lackey of the west. Not saying that's what you want, but like I said, diasporas of nations tend to not align with the home country.


It's thin at most. Besides that they're really using some non-evidence from social media to drive home his point that some anti-government people are so anti-government that they align with Israel.

Memri is run by a former IDF officer. While there are some nutso religious programs on TV, they tend to blow it out of proportion with worst interpretation translations and outright lies.

It is just so weird trying to argue with someone on how Iranian I am. Where are you from by the way?

 

[Smacktard]

Yeah I'm not a fan of this "Iranian purity test" thing. I think Leandros is really just trying to reconcile the dissonance between you claiming most Iranians feel ONE way, and his personal experiences that inform him OTHERWISE.

Personally, it also doesn't make sense to me when you claim Iranians are mostly pro-Israel. I'm not saying I disbelieve you, but I also don't trust you unquestioningly. I don't think you're misrepresenting your personal experiences, and I don't think you have some sort of ulterior motive -- I just haven't seen any evidence that supports your claims other than "trust me bro". I understand that information is tightly controlled in Iran, so we're not likely to get any good polling results or any other feel for general consensus, so I'm stuck in this kind of informational grey area regarding a concern that I find genuinely quite interesting.

 

[aiat_gamer]

Yeah I'm not a fan of this "Iranian purity test" thing. I think Leandros is really just trying to reconcile the dissonance between you claiming most Iranians feel ONE way, and his personal experiences that inform him OTHERWISE.

Personally, it also doesn't make sense to me when you claim Iranians are mostly pro-Israel. I'm not saying I disbelieve you, but I also don't trust you unquestioningly. I don't think you're misrepresenting your personal experiences, and I don't think you have some sort of ulterior motive -- I just haven't seen any evidence that supports your claims other than "trust me bro". I understand that information is tightly controlled in Iran, so we're not likely to get any good polling results or any other feel for general consensus, so I'm stuck in this kind of informational grey area regarding a concern that I find genuinely quite interesting.

Well, the thing is my entire experience from decades of being, you know, an Iranian. I used to be pretty religious (some might even remember me arguing in favor of Islam way back then on the forums). I was pretty into the whole religious government can work, and with voting and participating in the "process" things can get better.

I do have connections with both side (pro religion and anti religion) both family and otherwise. I have seen how the general sentiment has changed over the years. From what I have seen around me, and like comments and discussions on Persian speaking websites and boards, majority support Israel in their goal to destroy Hamas by any means. I don't mean everyone single person is this way, but from my experience (which is not a small sample), even in my rather large family which is pretty religious in general, pro-Israel is the majority.
The thing is, no offence, but you guys have no idea how deeply majority hate organizations like Hamas and Hezbollah. We have first hand experience of how awful it is to give these extreme nutjobs power and they wont let go no matter what.

Overall, all I have is my personal experience that is miles miles ahead of anyone else here. Added to that is my experience on both sides, where one day I was pretty fanatical about the regime side. I just did not wake up one day and randomly decide to be against everything I believed in for about 3 decades of my life. The pure (and sad in way) truth is that majority of Iranians are so sick and tired of living under extremist religious zealots that they do not care one bit about what happens in Gaza. To our eyes Hamas has to be destroyed no matter what, otherwise these things will never stop happening. They did try to give "power to the people" in 2006, and they turned around and voted to be governed under Hamas. With no more elections since that day, this is where we are now.

 

[shortkut]

Well, the thing is my entire experience from decades of being, you know, an Iranian. I used to be pretty religious (some might even remember me arguing in favor of Islam way back then on the forums). I was pretty into the whole religious government can work, and with voting and participating in the "process" things can get better.

I do have connections with both side (pro religion and anti religion) both family and otherwise. I have seen how the general sentiment has changed over the years. From what I have seen around me, and like comments and discussions on Persian speaking websites and boards, majority support Israel in their goal to destroy Hamas by any means. I don't mean everyone single person is this way, but from my experience (which is not a small sample), even in my rather large family which is pretty religious in general, pro-Israel is the majority.
The thing is, no offence, but you guys have no idea how deeply majority hate organizations like Hamas and Hezbollah. We have first hand experience of how awful it is to give these extreme nutjobs power and they wont let go no matter what.

Overall, all I have is my personal experience that is miles miles ahead of anyone else here. Added to that is my experience on both sides, where one day I was pretty fanatical about the regime side. I just did not wake up one day and randomly decide to be against everything I believed in for about 3 decades of my life. The pure (and sad in way) truth is that majority of Iranians are so sick and tired of living under extremist religious zealots that they do not care one bit about what happens in Gaza. To our eyes Hamas has to be destroyed no matter what, otherwise these things will never stop happening. They did try to give "power to the people" in 2006, and they turned around and voted to be governed under Hamas. With no more elections since that day, this is where we are now.

My interpretation of your comments, before and this one, are that you are stating most Iranians are only pro-Israel over THIS issue with regards to the Palestinians from Gaza, and not pro-Israel for ALL issues with a goal of having them control the Middle East like @Leandros? seemingly implied you were stating. Is that right, or did I misunderstand parts of your posts?