wolf the last day

[Jon]

The second a Trickster Wolf is shown as dead I think you gotta play the board as you see it. Which means killing a known wolf you have in hand. Every day that goes by with no SK kill means it's more likely they're gone.

I know... I said that. I was speaking from the perspective of this town. Which was convinced the SK was still alive. I still hold that that's what allowed the couple to thrive this game.

 

[Jon]

Well that and the only Gunner was murdered before posting.

 

[VashTheStampede]

I know... I said that. I was speaking from the perspective of this town. Which was convinced the SK was still alive.

Yeah, i get ya. I was just explaining why that felt like such an unforced error to me.

 

[A Baby Maker]

That was glorious, @Ben


You hadn't yet, though. Not REALLY. Immediately killing CG leaves it Ben vs. you and dimmer. And Ben had to choose right. Granted, it's easy since you can't protect yourself, BUT both Benzine and I missed that, so who knows. This is BEFORE Ben finally gave the breakdown. So you hadn't YET lost.

But... every time you guys got close, you overanalyzed and self sabotaged. Which amused me.

I'm just so glad I'm not a strong player and no one considers me for Cupid couple. Thank fuck.

I know the doctor can't protect himself and therefore the thought never crossed my mind to try it, so yes, we had lost at that point.

Also I wasn't so much trying to talk myself out of kat being the SK as I was continuously bringing it up as a possibility and explaining how. I just always thought it was low odds to happen unless Zell was paired with a wolf, because I forgot CG had said he tried to kill Kat that same night.

Like you guys keep saying "why didn't you just stick with that?" when we didn't have the same information as you and it was a much lower odds situation than not, especially because it would likely have taken knowing Kat was going to be killed that night by non-wolf means. Which again, would indicate knowing a paired person was going to do it.

And believing there was still a potential arsonist or SK out there meant that if we killed the known wolf but the SK was still there, basically everyone could have been wiped out the next day and it would have been game over.


I think we need to stop judging the moves people make in the live game from the dead thread with all of the information at hand. Bringing it up constantly and saying "how could you possibly have done this?!" is part of the reason why people have gotten frustrated with these games in the past. No one likes to be harassed for doing what they can with the information they have available to them.

 

[A Baby Maker]

Yeah, i get ya. I was just explaining why that felt like such an unforced error to me.

This is fine though, you're of the opinion that taking out the known entity is a better move. But "why didn't you guys just figure it out!?" is the frustrating part.

 

[VashTheStampede]

I think we need to stop judging the moves people make in the live game from the dead thread with all of the information at hand. Bringing it up constantly and saying "how could you possibly have done this?!" is part of the reason why people have gotten frustrated with these games in the past. No one likes to be harassed for doing what they can with the information they have available to them.

yeah well when you're eliminated early in a game, it's really the only way to feel like you're involved

This is fine though, you're of the opinion that taking out the known entity is a better move. But "why didn't you guys just figure it out!?" is the frustrating part.

Yeah i wanna be clear that I'm not like "you fucked up" I'm just pontificating on my personal philosophy

But to be even more truthful, knowing me, in the moment I would go back and forth on that philosophy about 8 times a minute

 

[Jon]

I know the doctor can't protect himself and therefore the thought never crossed my mind to try it, so yes, we had lost at that point.

Also I wasn't so much trying to talk myself out of kat being the SK as I was continuously bringing it up as a possibility and explaining how. I just always thought it was low odds to happen unless Zell was paired with a wolf, because I forgot CG had said he tried to kill Kat that same night.

Like you guys keep saying "why didn't you just stick with that?" when we didn't have the same information as you and it was a much lower odds situation than not, especially because it would likely have taken knowing Kat was going to be killed that night by non-wolf means. Which again, would indicate knowing a paired person was going to do it.

And believing there was still a potential arsonist or SK out there meant that if we killed the known wolf but the SK was still there, basically everyone could have been wiped out the next day and it would have been game over.


I think we need to stop judging the moves people make in the live game from the dead thread with all of the information at hand. Bringing it up constantly and saying "how could you possibly have done this?!" is part of the reason why people have gotten frustrated with these games in the past. No one likes to be harassed for doing what they can with the information they have available to them.

Then we should probably not have a dead thread at all...

Criticisms and questioning choices is pretty much all that happens there. It's an opinion based subforum. If that's a problem, you need to get rid of it.

I really think I just need to stop playing altogether. I keep trying to come back to these games and being engaged, but stuff like this reminds me exactly why I DON'T like them. Add that to always being on people's sus list... I just don't enjoy the games anymore. If being chastised for voicing an opinion when you're killed is another thing gone, then playing these games truly are an afterthought. I felt much happier for the few months we weren't bickering over who did what and why.

 

[VashTheStampede]

Then we should probably not have a dead thread at all...

Criticisms and questioning choices is pretty much all that happens there. It's an opinion based subforum. If that's a problem, you need to get rid of it.

I think it's just an issue of tone. Tough to find the line between analysis and criticism but we can keep working at it.

 

[canadaguy]

Yeah, agreed. They didn't know that I wasn't the one paired, so it seemed weird to just ignore me as a problem for later.

We were perfectly happy leaving you alive since we wanted the wolf kill without having to blow FR's cover.

 

[Ben]

 

[canadaguy]

Again, it wasn't so much the threat of the couple as it was the threat of the SK, in my eyes. The couple only controlled the vote late. The SK was the issue. And to me, CG, the second he didn't follow the plan, screamed anti town, whether it was the couple or SK. Killing you over him there is just silly.

Could only be the couple at that point, was proven to be witch already.

 

[A Baby Maker]

Then we should probably not have a dead thread at all...

Criticisms and questioning choices is pretty much all that happens there. It's an opinion based subforum. If that's a problem, you need to get rid of it.

I really think I just need to stop playing altogether. I keep trying to come back to these games and being engaged, but stuff like this reminds me exactly why I DON'T like them. Add that to always being on people's sus list... I just don't enjoy the games anymore. If being chastised for voicing an opinion when you're killed is another thing gone, then playing these games truly are an afterthought. I felt much happier for the few months we weren't bickering over who did what and why.

It's what Vash said, the tone involved with it.

"Oh man, you were SO close to getting there!" is very different than "How could they possibly not get it!?"

The latter implies that it should have been a simple task and people were just dumb for missing it. The former is "man it's tough and they still almost managed to figure it out"

 

[dimmerwit]

Again, it wasn't so much the threat of the couple as it was the threat of the SK, in my eyes. The couple only controlled the vote late. The SK was the issue. And to me, CG, the second he didn't follow the plan, screamed anti town, whether it was the couple or SK. Killing you over him there is just silly.

It made literally zero difference. The fact is the moment cg outed himself as a coupled player it was over.

 

[Ben]

It made literally zero difference. The fact is the moment cg outed himself as a coupled player it was over.

It didn't have to be. It was still possible for them to lose, had we three voted against them. You/Alu just decided to let the cupid couple win. It's whatever, but "they'd already won" isn't really true.

I think we can all just agree that none of this would have happened if Tommy got to shoot gun.

 

[A Baby Maker]

It didn't have to be. It was still possible for them to lose, had we three voted against them. You/Alu just decided to let the cupid couple win. It's whatever, but "they'd already won" isn't really true.

I think we can all just agree that none of this would have happened if Tommy got to shoot gun.

"They already won" isn't what I said. I said "we already lost"

 

[A Baby Maker]

Also yes Tommy please shoot gun

 

[dimmerwit]

It didn't have to be. It was still possible for them to lose, had we three voted against them. You/Alu just decided to let the cupid couple win. It's whatever, but "they'd already won" isn't really true.

I think we can all just agree that none of this would have happened if Tommy got to shoot gun.

I meant from the town perspective. As I said before, I didn't really care who won if we couldn't. Maybe you would have followed through with your deal, but honestly I would have found that a bit hollow.

Sentence two should be true but we do have a slightly unfortunate record with Gunners!

 

[VashTheStampede]

#JustIceForTommyBoy

 

[VashTheStampede]

Sentence two should be true but we do have a slightly unfortunate record with Gunners!

My hope was that when I teased that I was gonna try and kill a wolf on Night 1 that they'd let it play out with my record of townie killing

Little did I know at the time that the wolf team was the Anti Vash Revengers

 

[canadaguy]

"They already won" isn't what I said. I said "we already lost"

So even going into that last day, we were convinced the town could walk it in, until we saw the remaining list and ran each scenario through. The last couple phases, things really fell together perfect for us.


Kat getting trickstered though was probably the biggest moment in the game. So many decisions from there reverberated later on.

 

[Ben]

My hope was that when I teased that I was gonna try and kill a wolf on Night 1 that they'd let it play out with my record of townie killing

Little did I know at the time that the wolf team was the Anti Vash Revengers

I asked your wife if it was okay to kill you. I figured she had power of attorney to turn off life support.

The "life support" being your beating heart.

 

[VashTheStampede]

I asked your wife if it was okay to kill you. I figured she had power of attorney to turn off life support.

The "life support" being your beating heart.

When she told me post-death that it was you and Jon along with her (along with FR but we dont have as much history) I knew I never had a chance to really play this time

 

[canadaguy]

Even though I was coupled with FR, Local sure was in love with me this game tho

 

[A Baby Maker]

Even though I was coupled with FR, Local sure was in love with me this game tho

I protected you most nights as well once you revealed you had a kill shot. Also I didn't believe local because he always claims to be a protector role except when he's a non-protector role townie.

 

[VashTheStampede]

All y'all simpin for the North

 

[Ben]

When she told me post-death that it was you and Jon along with her (along with FR but we dont have as much history) I knew I never had a chance to really play this time

To be honest, it was a d20 that did you dirty.

I said;
1-6 Local,
7-12 Vash,
13-19 Alu,
20 this idea was dumb.

And rolled an 8.

Technically I guess I gave you and Local each a 30% chance, Alu a 35%, and 5% to fail.

 

[A Baby Maker]

To be honest, it was a d20 that did you dirty.

I said;
1-6 Local,
7-12 Vash,
13-19 Alu,
20 this idea was dumb.

And rolled an 8.

Technically I guess I gave you and Local each a 30% chance, Alu a 35%, and 5% to fail.

I had the highest odds of being picked?

 

[Ben]

In retrospect wasn't that one of the Benzine® Original Twists (aka mistakes)? I assume berserk killing a Beast Hunter with a trap on themselves should still trap a wolf, even if it didn't protect the Hunter.

I had the highest odds of being picked?

Yeah because I'm dumb at math and didn't think that much when making a roll table.

Fail should have been 19-20. Or rather, 1-2.

 

[Jon]

When she told me post-death that it was you and Jon along with her (along with FR but we dont have as much history) I knew I never had a chance to really play this time

You do know I have absolutely nothing against you and do not seek to hunt you (or anyone) down in any game though, right?

Like, I feel like I have this reputation of a single minded fuckhead who makes impulsive choices and holds grudges. When literally none of that is true and I take each game individually. I often advocate for taking people Alu and Zell out because they can literally change the tides of games with their words. But I do not target anyone for reasons outside the current game.

I know I suck at this game, but I'm not evil. Even when the roll calls for it.

 

[VashTheStampede]

Omg Jon stop attacking me jeez

 

[Ben]

You do know I have absolutely nothing against you and do not seek to hunt you (or anyone) down in any game though, right?

Like, I feel like I have this reputation of a single minded fuckhead who makes impulsive choices and holds grudges. When literally none of that is true and I take each game individually. I often advocate for taking people Alu and Zell out because they can literally change the tides of games with their words. But I do not target anyone for reasons outside the current game.

I know I suck at this game, but I'm not evil. Even when the roll calls for it.

I get you. And same, I only target those individuals like Vash frequently because they're the ones I most expect will a) work out the truth and b) convince others to believe them. I'm scurred.

If I make statements about him killing me in prison before, or Kat bullying me, it's generally just to play off why I actually want them dead due to being a baddie. Holding grudges from past games does nothing helpful.

 

[VashTheStampede]

I see you all worked out your stories ahead of time

Clever

 

[Ben]

I see you all worked out your stories ahead of time

Clever

Bold of you to assume I can work anything out.

 

[Ben]

I mean my teammate was fucking an occult lumberjack and I never questioned why there was a flannel thong in the bathroom until they got engaged.

 

[Zell 17]

We already lost at that point and the game was better played by the cupid pair. I'm not playing with spite.

Very fair

 

[Jon]

I see you all worked out your stories ahead of time

Clever

Ben and I just think very similarly about these games

 

[Fool's Requiem]

I mean my teammate was fucking an occult lumberjack and I never questioned why there was a flannel thong in the bathroom until they got engaged.

Witches get me hot, what can I say?

 

[A Baby Maker]

You do know I have absolutely nothing against you and do not seek to hunt you (or anyone) down in any game though, right?

Like, I feel like I have this reputation of a single minded fuckhead who makes impulsive choices and holds grudges. When literally none of that is true and I take each game individually. I often advocate for taking people Alu and Zell out because they can literally change the tides of games with their words. But I do not target anyone for reasons outside the current game.

I know I suck at this game, but I'm not evil. Even when the roll calls for it.

I say vote for Zell.

Zell says vote for alu.


Oh shit words.

 

[canadaguy]

All y'all simpin for the North

This better not be some 51st state bullshit

 

[A Baby Maker]

This better not be some 51st state bullshit

More like a we're hoping you'll take us on as refugees thing

 

[shortkut]

 

[Ben]

I wonder how a game where no one dies, you just lose your powers, would work... No one gets eliminated and sent to a dead thread, you can participate the whole time, but it's still wolves trying to equal empowered town and town trying to purge all the wolf powers, etc.

 

[Fool's Requiem]

I wonder how a game where no one dies, you just lose your powers, would work... No one gets eliminated and sent to a dead thread, you can participate the whole time, but it's still wolves trying to equal empowered town and town trying to purge all the wolf powers, etc.

the first meme game let us spam the game chat even while dead.

 

[VashTheStampede]

the first meme game let us spam the game chat even while dead.

I had to stop myself a couple times this go-around

Don't kill me guys, it's not good for my brain

 

[Ants!]

Personally I take the known wolf out because of the off-chance he's the paired one. You lose nothing really.

We all know you just didn't want the cupid couple to win!

 

[VashTheStampede]

We all know you just didn't want the cupid couple to win!

 

[dimmerwit]

I wonder how a game where no one dies, you just lose your powers, would work... No one gets eliminated and sent to a dead thread, you can participate the whole time, but it's still wolves trying to equal empowered town and town trying to purge all the wolf powers, etc.

There are other games like Blood on the Clocktower that do something like this, but I'm not sure how well they'd translate to a forum format.

 

[canadaguy]

But taking out the known wolf actually means the couple DOES win

 

[Ben]

There are other games like Blood on the Clocktower that do something like this, but I'm not sure how well they'd translate to a forum format.

Never heard of them, but other games was also something I'd pondered.

But even working with the general structure we have now, I'm thinking things like "only roles are announced when eliminated, not the player who had it", "medium can restore someone's power instead of resurrect", "wolves can optionally turn someone with no power like a werewolf fan".

Might eliminate people feeling left out from dying early, keep them engaged, spread chaos with team alignment changes, etc.

I'm sure it'd need a lot of work shopping, though.

 

[shortkut]

I don’t know why Ben didn’t take out canadaguy, especially once the town showed they were busy looking for the SK