VTS Mafia VTS Mafia Night 2/Day 2

[Cole]

Im laying out my thought process.

which thought process is "repeatedly tell everyone I'm innocent"?

 

[shortkut]

If I was gunner I’d shoot myself

 

[Zell 17]

which thought process is "repeatedly tell everyone I'm innocent"?

Telling everyone that you are mafia seems have have somehow removed you from suspicion so maybe I should sit and learn.

 

[Cole]

Telling everyone that you are mafia seems have have somehow removed you from suspicion so maybe I should sit and learn.

is THAT what I did?

please, show, and be specific.

 

[canadaguy]

 

[shortkut]

maybe I should sit and learn.

 

[canadaguy]

For the record I would like to see Cole on trial next

 

[shortkut]

For the record I would like to see Cole on trial next

Protecting Cole or zell?

 

[canadaguy]

Not protecting anyone

 

[shortkut]

Not protecting anyone

 

[Cole]

For the record I would like to see Cole on trial next

why would you like to see that, old friend?

 

[shortkut]

 

[Zell 17]

is THAT what I did?

please, show, and be specific.

With joy

Post in thread 'VTS Mafia Night 1/Day 1'
https://gwforums.com/threads/vts-mafia-night-1-day-1.628/post-29956

 

[Cole]

With joy

Post in thread 'VTS Mafia Night 1/Day 1'
https://gwforums.com/threads/vts-mafia-night-1-day-1.628/post-29956

I think I figured out your problem.

lying by repeatedly saying "I AM A MEMBER OF THE TOWN EVERYONE SHOULD LISTEN TO ME AND WHAT I SAY"

subtle.

a sarcastic joke clearly not playing your game.

the actual truth.

got it.

 

[shortkut]

With joy

Post in thread 'VTS Mafia Night 1/Day 1'
https://gwforums.com/threads/vts-mafia-night-1-day-1.628/post-29956

 

[canadaguy]

why would you like to see that, old friend?

I think we will learn more with you in the hot seat than him.

 

[Zell 17]

I think I figured out your problem.

lying by repeatedly saying "I AM A MEMBER OF THE TOWN EVERYONE SHOULD LISTEN TO ME AND WHAT I SAY"

subtle.

a sarcastic joke clearly not playing your game.

the actual truth.

got it.

I made a joke about wanting to kill you even if you were a citizen but that was SERIOUS BUSINESS.

 

[Cole]

I think we will learn more with you in the hot seat than him.

I really don't think you'll learn anything I haven't told you.

 

[shortkut]

I think we will learn more with you in the hot seat than him.

 

[Cole]

I made a joke about wanting to kill you even if you were a citizen but that was SERIOUS BUSINESS.

that wasnt a joke, you already admitted that was "anger".

so now you're doubling back on *THAT*.

 

[canadaguy]

I really don't think you'll learn anything I haven't told you.

You'd be surprised

 

[Zell 17]

What’s more interesting to me is not Cole being Coleman, but why shortkut is so vigorously supporting him.

Kut, you think Cole is town that strongly or what

 

[Cole]

You'd be surprised

as the one who would have the information to give, I can promise you, I won't be.

 

[Zell 17]

that wasnt a joke, you already admitted that was "anger".

so now you're doubling back on *THAT*.

Yeah being annoyed doesn’t remove one’s ability to make a joke.

 

[Cole]

What’s more interesting to me is not Cole being Coleman, but why shortkut is so vigorously supporting him.

Kut, you think Cole is town that strongly or what

the way you defended Kat?

before killing her to frame me because I said she was suspicious?

is that what you're about to try on shortkut?

 

[Cole]

Yeah being annoyed doesn’t remove one’s ability to make a joke.

I mean in this case it does.

other people need to understand its a joke for it to be a joke.

 

[shortkut]

What’s more interesting to me is not Cole being Coleman, but why shortkut is so vigorously supporting him.

Kut, you think Cole is town that strongly or what

I wanted you on trial day 1. If anything Cole is supporting me

 

[canadaguy]

as the one who would have the information to give, I can promise you, I won't be.

Never said the information would come from you

 

[TD]

@TD - trial question: what are your thoughts on zell?

One juror asking what I think of another juror.

I graded out my suspicion rankings (scored out of 10, 10 being extremely suspicious). Full rankings will be shared soon. I'll add, nothing more than intuition.

I have Zell among the highest at 7/10 right now. But he could easily swing to the other side, he's either really guilty or just looks really guilty.

- The argument with Cole, the way he defended the strategy that the mafia used so openly and aggressively to the point of voting Cole was strange. However, I feel like that's almost too obvious? I can't ignore it though.
- Publically saying he's fine with the Vigilante killing him, which at the time seemed like innocence but when I thought about it (and after seeing no Vigilante kill), I feel like there's at least a possibility that Tommy or Smacktard were the Vigilante and he felt comfortably saying that to "prove innocence" but knew it wouldn't happen.
- The way he jumped on Cole immediately today with Kat dying absolutely reeked of a frame job.

 

[canadaguy]

One juror asking what I think of another juror.

Is this grounds for a mistrial?

 

[Zell 17]

One juror asking what I think of another juror.

I graded out my suspicion rankings (scored out of 10, 10 being extremely suspicious). Full rankings will be shared soon. I'll add, nothing more than intuition.

I have Zell among the highest at 7/10 right now. But he could easily swing to the other side, he's either really guilty or just looks really guilty.

- The argument with Cole, the way he defended the strategy that the mafia used so openly and aggressively to the point of voting Cole was strange. However, I feel like that's almost too obvious? I can't ignore it though.
- Publically saying he's fine with the Vigilante killing him, which at the time seemed like innocence but when I thought about it (and after seeing no Vigilante kill), I feel like there's at least a possibility that Tommy or Smacktard were the Vigilante and he felt comfortably saying that to "prove innocence" but knew it wouldn't happen.
- The way he jumped on Cole immediately today with Kat dying absolutely reeked of a frame job.

This is logical! Kat dying is really the best point of INNOCENCE for Cole TBH.

But the whole thread yesterday Cole talked about how everyone’s reads were bad while saying Kat was the most suspicious for simply asking him to defend his illogic. But he’s not gonna see that and say “hey, maybe I should revisit my assumptions” it’s gonna be full speed ahead until another citizen is dead. Probably me.

 

[TD]

Is this grounds for a mistrial?

 

[shortkut]

One juror asking what I think of another juror.

I graded out my suspicion rankings (scored out of 10, 10 being extremely suspicious). Full rankings will be shared soon. I'll add, nothing more than intuition.

I have Zell among the highest at 7/10 right now. But he could easily swing to the other side, he's either really guilty or just looks really guilty.

- The argument with Cole, the way he defended the strategy that the mafia used so openly and aggressively to the point of voting Cole was strange. However, I feel like that's almost too obvious? I can't ignore it though.
- Publically saying he's fine with the Vigilante killing him, which at the time seemed like innocence but when I thought about it (and after seeing no Vigilante kill), I feel like there's at least a possibility that Tommy or Smacktard were the Vigilante and he felt comfortably saying that to "prove innocence" but knew it wouldn't happen.
- The way he jumped on Cole immediately today with Kat dying absolutely reeked of a frame job.

Thank you for your thoughts. I am leaning towards a bit guilty verdict, you seem to be on the level

 

[canadaguy]

Thank you for your thoughts. I am leaning towards a bit guilty verdict, you seem to be on the level

View attachment 2243

"a bit" guilty?

 

[Zell 17]

One juror asking what I think of another juror.

I graded out my suspicion rankings (scored out of 10, 10 being extremely suspicious). Full rankings will be shared soon. I'll add, nothing more than intuition.

I have Zell among the highest at 7/10 right now. But he could easily swing to the other side, he's either really guilty or just looks really guilty.

- The argument with Cole, the way he defended the strategy that the mafia used so openly and aggressively to the point of voting Cole was strange. However, I feel like that's almost too obvious? I can't ignore it though.
- Publically saying he's fine with the Vigilante killing him, which at the time seemed like innocence but when I thought about it (and after seeing no Vigilante kill), I feel like there's at least a possibility that Tommy or Smacktard were the Vigilante and he felt comfortably saying that to "prove innocence" but knew it wouldn't happen.
- The way he jumped on Cole immediately today with Kat dying absolutely reeked of a frame job.

Also this is a really good point about the Vigilante. I think it’s very likely they are dead or not in the game. But frankly I wanted to be shot because I’m useless, it would prove the vigilante, and I wasn’t having fun arguing with Cole about the dumbest shit imaginable. Still am not.

 

[Cole]

Never said the information would come from you

ooo valid.

This is logical! Kat dying is really the best point of INNOCENCE for Cole TBH.

But the whole thread yesterday Cole talked about how everyone’s reads were bad while saying Kat was the most suspicious for simply asking him to defend his illogic. But he’s not gonna see that and say “hey, maybe I should revisit my assumptions” it’s gonna be full speed ahead until another citizen is dead. Probably me.

FRAME JOB. STEP 2.

let's lay it out.

Cole says "Kat is suspicious"
Zell says "Kat is not suspicious!"
*KAT DIES*
Clearly the work of criminal mastermind Cole who would DEFINITELY lay out the one person he had named as most suspicious.

does this level of play usually work for you?

 

[shortkut]

"a bit" guilty?

Not guilty but can’t edit or I’d be guilty of a capital offense

 

[Zell 17]

ooo valid.

FRAME JOB. STEP 2.

let's lay it out.

Cole says "Kat is suspicious"
Zell says "Kat is not suspicious!"
*KAT DIES*
Clearly the work of criminal mastermind Cole who would DEFINITELY lay out the one person he had named as most suspicious.

does this level of play usually work for you?

Yeah I think it should be pretty obvious that I would never play it like that. But if I was , I’d also say “Look Kat thought Cole was suspicious and she’s dead!”

 

[canadaguy]

Obviously a different legal system, but I think we need @Crazy Jamie to confirm if we are doing law properly here

 

[shortkut]

Obviously a different legal system, but I think we need @Crazy Jamie to confirm if we are doing law properly here

The more @Crazy Jamie the better

 

[VashTheStampede]

"a bit" guilty?

 

[Cole]

Yeah I think it should be pretty obvious that I would never play it like that. But if I was , I’d also say “Look Kat thought Cole was suspicious and she’s dead!”

alright I understand.

you don't think I'm stupid enough to kill the person I was suspicious of.

you think I'm even stupider and would kill someone that was suspicious of me.

...guess I know what you think of my skill. I just hope enough people agree with you that I would do something that stupid.

but you keep on with your base level frame job. let me know how it works out.

 

[Zell 17]

alright I understand.

you don't think I'm stupid enough to kill the person I was suspicious of.

you think I'm even stupider and would kill someone that was suspicious of me.

...guess I know what you think of my skill. I just hope enough people agree with you that I would do something that stupid.

but you keep on with your base level frame job. let me know how it works out.

Im putting you on stand so that we can hear your role claim and what info you know. That’s the primary reason already stated. The fact that you might be evil is a secondary bonus.

 

[TD]

Hi.
I'm done work.

 

[canadaguy]

Hi.
I'm done work.

And what type of work is it you do?

 

[TD]

for one, please spare me the "Cole isnt dead he must be one of them" conversations. Its the oldest setup in the book. ALSO FUN FACT: shortkut routinely says he likes to keep me Alive in these games when he's an evil to make it more of a challenge. The last game he was evil and I was town, I was seer checked and they didnt want the role in the game, so they killed me. maybe this is him trying to let me stay Alive, especially in a game where the mafia has the Advantage, maybe he's sporting enough to let me try.

For argument's sake, if I was ever Wolf/Mafia and Cole was a townie (huh.. we've been on the same side every time.. so far), I would definitely not kill him earlier. Yeah, he can be a threat - but the longer someone like Cole remains alive, the more suspicious the town would get and will inevitably turn on him unless he's taking down wolves.

Disclaimer: I am not convinced of his current alliances.

 

[TD]

And what type of work is it you do?

 

[Cole]

Im putting you on stand so that we can hear your role claim and what info you know. That’s the primary reason already stated. The fact that you might be evil is a secondary bonus.

yeah, you can certainly try. the best part is how you'll look after.

 

[Zell 17]

Im likely done with the thread for the day.

Vote TD not guilty

 

[shortkut]

Where are you from?