Spiner Watches Old WWE PPVs

[Spiner202]

But it was 2012 when I stopped watching it weekly completely. The shit they pulled to have Cena vs Rock: Twice in a Lifetime was the final straw for me. The moment when Rock announced on the 1000 episode of RAW he was challenging for the title at the 2013 Royal Rumble, you knew damn well where they were going. Rock was winning the title from Punk at the Rumble and Cena was going to win the event so he could get his win back.

The Rock is genuinely confusing because he came back in January of this year and cut a very weak promo. Then he somehow stole the Wrestlemania spot from the Royal Rumble winner, and received so much negative feedback that WWE has now pivoted and The Rock is almost embarrassing everyone else on the roster with how good he is at building this Mania. He's gone full heel and it's awesome.

 

[MC74]

The Rock is genuinely confusing because he came back in January of this year and cut a very weak promo. Then he somehow stole the Wrestlemania spot from the Royal Rumble winner, and received so much negative feedback that WWE has now pivoted and The Rock is almost embarrassing everyone else on the roster with how good he is at building this Mania. He's gone full heel and it's awesome.

I can't comment on his run this year because I haven't seen any of it to give my two cents on the matter, but I do agree. If he's gone full heel Hollywood Rock, then that definitely does make things more interesting.

 

[Webster]

Then he somehow stole the Wrestlemania spot from the Royal Rumble winner,

That royally pisses me off because Cody Rhodes earned that spot at Wrestlemania; that could've been one of the biggest storylines in Mania history - can the American Nightmare do what his father Dusty Rhodes couldn't do, win WWE's biggest championship?

 

[Spiner202]

I'm currently watching Summerslam 2004. This was an interesting PPV because I was at it! I was 11, and I'm not sure when I stopped watching but it was probably sometime shortly after this.

In the PPV's prior to this, the highlight was definitely Orton vs. Foley at Backlash. Another very brutal hardcore match for Mick, and it feels like one of the few that is outside the Attitude Era/with a younger generation (even if Orton is now the old generation).

 

[Webster]

Summerslam 2004

Good thing Randy Orton beat Chris Benoit for the World Heavyweight Championship there or WWE would've un-personed that title reign as well as everything else Benoit did in the ring.

 

[Spiner202]

Good thing Randy Orton beat Chris Benoit for the World Heavyweight Championship there or WWE would've un-personed that title reign as well as everything else Benoit did in the ring.

Interestingly enough, WMXX and Backlash didn't seem too censored. Obviously I don't recall everything on the original broadcasts, but they certainly didn't shy away from mentioning Benoit.

That said, I'm starting Triple H vs. Eugene, so maybe some storylines should have been erased altogether.

 

[MC74]

If you ever get the chance, I strongly recommend Wrestlemania XIX. I have that one on DVD as part of the 2003 collection. For me personally, it's my second favorite Mania event.

 

[VashTheStampede]

I finished Summerslam 2002 and that was a truly excellent PPV. 3 all-time great matches: Rey Mysterio vs. Kurt Angle, The Rock vs. Brock Lesnar, and Shawn Michaels vs. Triple H. It was great to see Michaels back in action, and this was also the first Mysterio sighting so far. While Rey is looking a little old these days, his younger years were something amazing to watch.

Top 10 WWE PPV and the HBK/HHH match is one of my 10 favorite matches of all time.

 

[Webster]

Interestingly enough, WMXX and Backlash didn't seem too censored. Obviously I don't recall everything on the original broadcasts, but they certainly didn't shy away from mentioning Benoit.

The unpersoning reference, Spiner, comes from how, following the murders of Nancy & Daniel Benoit, WWE went out of its way to scrub and erase Chris Benoit's name from everything in their video vault.

Even today, as they've started to re-person him, there's lots of WWE video out there where his name is either censored out or scrubbed in some manner.

 

[MC74]

The unpersoning reference, Spiner, comes from how, following the murders of Nancy & Daniel Benoit, WWE went out of its way to scrub and erase Chris Benoit's name from everything in their video vault.

Even today, as they've started to re-person him, there's lots of WWE video out there where his name is either censored out or scrubbed in some manner.

There's a video of him being silhouetted out at Wrestlemania XX, when he celebrated with Eddie.

 

[Webster]

There's a video of him being silhouetted out at Wrestlemania XX, when he celebrated with Eddie.

That's the unpersoning, MJF.

Vince McMahon said something a while back about how WWE should treat him and that's the O.J. Simpson treatment - acknowledge his in-ring work while also acknowledging that he committed a horrific double murder.

 

[Spiner202]

That's what is so strange about Backlash 2004 - if you had no idea what Benoit did, you'd think he was a hero. That PPV was in his hometown and his family is sitting ringside. I actually found that harder to watch that the WMXX main event where he celebrates with Eddie at the end.

 

[MC74]

Kinda off-topic here, but seeing these discussions want to make me chime in with some retrospectives on angles that happened in the past.

Debating whether I should do one on Austin's heel turn in 2001 or not. That was something I wouldn't mind looking back on.

 

[Webster]

Debating whether I should do one on Austin's heel turn in 2001 or not. That was something I wouldn't mind looking back on.

 

[Webster]

That's what is so strange about Backlash 2004 - if you had no idea what Benoit did, you'd think he was a hero. That PPV was in his hometown and his family is sitting ringside. I actually found that harder to watch that the WMXX main event where he celebrates with Eddie at the end.

Imagine what David Benoit - Chris's son from if I remember correctly a previous marriage - probably has to deal with as he makes his way through the wrestling business.

 

[MC74]

I'll think about it.

 

[VashTheStampede]

Kinda off-topic here, but seeing these discussions want to make me chime in with some retrospectives on angles that happened in the past.

Debating whether I should do one on Austin's heel turn in 2001 or not. That was something I wouldn't mind looking back on.

I think that could be cool. I just got a bootleg blu-ray set that has the entire Sting vs nWo storyline and I've been planning on doing a write-up on it in here. Would be awesome for several people to do similar threads.

 

[Spiner202]

So what was going on in 2004 with some of the guys getting screen time? They have all these completely faceless people: Heidenreich, Luther Reigns, Gene Snitsky, Mark Jindrak, etc. It doesn't seem like any of these guys are any good or have any personality. I know that every era had people get pushed who weren't good, and we've forgotten most of them, but it seems like there are more than ever here.

 

[rktaker]

So what was going on in 2004 with some of the guys getting screen time? They have all these completely faceless people: Heidenreich, Luther Reigns, Gene Snitsky, Mark Jindrak, etc. It doesn't seem like any of these guys are any good or have any personality. I know that every era had people get pushed who weren't good, and we've forgotten most of them, but it seems like there are more than ever here.

because Vince liked his beef beefy guys with long wet hair

 

[Webster]

because Vince liked his beef beefy guys with long wet hair

Exactly.

Vince has his...mannerisms, and we're just along for the ride.

 

[MC74]

Exactly.

Vince has his...mannerisms, and we're just along for the ride.

Don't get me started on how they treated the women's division back then. Just ugh....

 

[Spiner202]

He's always had that obsession though. That was basically the basis for WWF pre-steroid trial. As I'm typing aloud here, I wonder if it's because they didn't have the well of WCW/ECW stars to draw upon anymore. 2002 saw the arrival of all the WCW guys who didn't come over in the Invasion angle. 2003 had Goldberg + Scott Steiner (he showed up in 2002, but didn't do anything until '03), and Kevin Nash doing a bit more. Then they pushed Guerrero/Benoit in early '04, and I guess they were out of ideas after that?

 

[Spiner202]

Ok I might have found one of the least-appropriate WWE segments in history that is never talked about.

At Wrestlemania 21, Eugene comes out and starts talking about "midgets" (his word, not mine) at Wrestlemania 3. He's interrupted by Muhammad Hassan and Daviari. They start attacking Eugene, until Hogan comes out and starts beating them up.

So we have 3 characters who aged poorly to begin with. Lawler says people hating Hassan isn't racist because there are plenty of reasons to hate them. And then notorious racist Hulk Hogan comes in to beat them up.

Of all the offensive WWE moments in history, I'm surprised this one never gets brought up because it's all sorts of terrible. The first ever Money in the Bank match that preceded it, however, was incredible. I thought I stopped watching after Summerslam 2004 because I didn't remember a single thing about Survivor Series, but two matches in and this show is very familiar to me.

 

[Webster]

And then notorious racist Hulk Hogan comes in to beat them up.

The only reason (or one of the few) Hogan still gets treated w/any semblance of respect, Spiner, is that it was his lawsuit agst. Gawker over that sex tape (which also had racist comments of his on it) that eventually shut down Gawker.

 

[MC74]

Ok I might have found one of the least-appropriate WWE segments in history that is never talked about.

At Wrestlemania 21, Eugene comes out and starts talking about "midgets" (his word, not mine) at Wrestlemania 3. He's interrupted by Muhammad Hassan and Daviari. They start attacking Eugene, until Hogan comes out and starts beating them up.

So we have 3 characters who aged poorly to begin with. Lawler says people hating Hassan isn't racist because there are plenty of reasons to hate them. And then notorious racist Hulk Hogan comes in to beat them up.

Of all the offensive WWE moments in history, I'm surprised this one never gets brought up because it's all sorts of terrible. The first ever Money in the Bank match that preceded it, however, was incredible. I thought I stopped watching after Summerslam 2004 because I didn't remember a single thing about Survivor Series, but two matches in and this show is very familiar to me.

The worst offender for me is always that storyline in the fall of 2002 which shall not be mentioned. It was so egregiously bad TSN had to cut to commercial during one of the segments.

 

[Spiner202]

*continues* And there were two signature matches that night (@Spiner202 brushed on one of them earlier)....per the Tropes,By the way, if you thought Michaels' 2002 match was awesome Spiner, wait 'til the 2005 match HBK had with Hulk Hogan....Jerry Lawler said it best that night,

Just watched the Summerslam 2005 Hogan vs. Michaels match. That was super entertaining, especially Michaels' sell of the final big boot. I understand why we don't want every match like this, but it was great.

 

[MC74]

Just watched the Summerslam 2005 Hogan vs. Michaels match. That was super entertaining, especially Michaels' sell of the final big boot. I understand why we don't want every match like this, but it was great.

I loved it for how Michaels responded to Hogan pulling the "That doesn't work for me, brother!" card. What's equally as memorable is the build-up towards the feud and Michaels' work as a heel. Don't get me wrong, his face run after returning was amazing, but damn, does Shawn play the role of prick well.

 

[Spiner202]

I'm temporarily taking a break from old PPVs and instead going backwards from the point at which I started re-watching WWE (Summerslam 2023). I'm on Day 2 of Wrestlemania 39 and it's pretty incredible the string of PLE's that they had from Mania 39 through Money in the Bank. And I say that knowing that the 2023 Royal Rumble and Elimination Chamber have some huge story beats to them. In hindsight, I probably should have just started around Wrestlemania 38 and gone forwards, but this is an interesting way to watch them too.

 

[Dead2009]

I'm temporarily taking a break from old PPVs and instead going backwards from the point at which I started re-watching WWE (Summerslam 2023). I'm on Day 2 of Wrestlemania 39 and it's pretty incredible the string of PLE's that they had from Mania 39 through Money in the Bank. And I say that knowing that the 2023 Royal Rumble and Elimination Chamber have some huge story beats to them. In hindsight, I probably should have just started around Wrestlemania 38 and gone forwards, but this is an interesting way to watch them too.

In terms of watching the old PPVs, I started at the '92 Rumble and now I'm on the '01 England show they ran before the whole "winner take all" Survivor Series thing. It's been a struggle lol.

 

[MC74]

I was foolish enough to watch through every episode of WWF RAW, plus the PPVs during the New Generation Era. It was so bad.

Granted, there are some gems here & there, but I trudged through A LOT of shit. 1995 was the fucking worst.

 

[Spiner202]

I slowed down for a little bit as I was watching some other shows over the past month, but I'm currently near the end of Summerslam 2007. Even though there are still a lot of random people showing up throughout the card, this era definitely feels more consistent than the years before it - largely because every big match is some combination of Batista/Undertaker/Cena/Edge/Orton/Michaels. I don't mind it, but I could see how watching every PPV (as opposed to just the ones I have available to me) would get tiring with just these guys.

Also, I have finally seen CM Punk a few times! His wrestling doesn't seem to be any extraordinary yet, but I think his best time in WWE is yet to come from what I understand.

I'm actually pretty excited to keep progressing from here. From my understanding, the next few years have all sorts of debuts of guys that I am seeing on TV now (The Miz, Sheamus, Drew McIntyre I think).

Also, most years to this point have had 4-5 PPVs available to me. Starting in 2009, that bumps up to about 7 for a 3-year period, and then starting in 2012, it increases even further, so I imagine it will take me a while to get past each year, but I'll get a more complete picture of the WWE at those points in time (perhaps, unfortunately, based now what I have heard).

 

[Spiner202]

I just started Wreslemania 24, which is the first HD PPV on the list. This honestly looks so much better. I have no problem watching old stuff, but it's nice to be out of that era. Also, I've mentioned earlier that the commentary audio was a bit spotty - some PPVs were clear and others were. This one is very clear, so I'm hoping that trend continues throughout the entirety of the HD era.

 

[MC74]

I just started Wreslemania 24, which is the first HD PPV on the list. This honestly looks so much better. I have no problem watching old stuff, but it's nice to be out of that era. Also, I've mentioned earlier that the commentary audio was a bit spotty - some PPVs were clear and others were. This one is very clear, so I'm hoping that trend continues throughout the entirety of the HD era.

The sad part is as you get mid-way into 2008, that's where the beginning of WWE's gradual downward trajectory begins. It begins after the Great American Bash when the company shifts towards being more PG, but when you get into 2009 and 2010, that's where things really start dropping off imo.

 

[Spiner202]

The sad part is as you get mid-way into 2008, that's where the beginning of WWE's gradual downward trajectory begins. It begins after the Great American Bash when the company shifts towards being more PG, but when you get into 2009 and 2010, that's where things really start dropping off imo.

For better or worse, I think watching just a handful of PPVs helps prevent me from seeing too much bad stuff. Sure, there are some bad or boring ideas, but that was true even in the Attitude era PPVs. In fact, early Ruthless Aggression era (2002-2004ish) was probably the most consistent era in the WWE.

Also, I'm in the middle of Wrestlemania 25, and the stars of the HD/PG era so far are easily Undertaker, Edge, and Shawn Michaels. So far, my favourite 3 matches from this era all involve Undertaker: HIAC vs. Batista (Survivor Series 2007), HIAC vs. Edge (Summerslam 2008) and vs. Shawn Michaels (Wrestlemania 25). I know those guys run it back at 26, so I'm looking forward to seeing that too.

 

[Spiner202]

This weekend I went to the Money in the Bank weekend in Toronto! This was Smackdown on Friday night, MITB on Saturday night, and NXT Heatwave last night.

All 3 events were completely awesome. Smackdown had the return of one of my favourite tag teams (Pretty Deadly), and we got to see Bianca Belair, Jade Cargill, and Bayley, all of whom are awesome and wouldn't be on the PLE card. The show was your standard Smackdown - it's personally my least favourite of the 3 WWE shows these days, but it had very little Bloodline, which is what I don't love about Smackdown, so it was great. The pre-show and post-show dark matches were great. Even though both Chad Gable and Iyo Sky were on the PLE, they made appearances in the dark matches and they're two of my favourites, so more great choices for me.

Money in the Bank on Saturday was insane. Both ladder matches were full of crazy spots and looked so incredibly painful. I was reasonably happy with the outcome of every match, other than Bron Breakker vs. Sami Zayn. I think Bron should have won that one. The energy in the crowd for these PLE's really is something else. I actually watched this back on Sunday morning and it felt totally fresh - it's cool to see it from the crowd's perspective, and the TV perspective. My favourite match was the women's MITB match. Iyo, Tiffany, and Chelsea are all totally nuts. The other 3 women in the match did a great job too, but those 3 are insane.

Heatwave was last night, and I feel really lucky to get to have seen an NXT event. They don't travel the world like the main roster, but NXT is honestly just them most fun thing. It doesn't take itself seriously at all, and all the fans (both online and in person) are super chill about it. This card was actually really underwhelming, but every single match delivered. I got to see the majority of my NXT favourites (Chase U, Oba Femi, Sol Ruca, Roxanne Perez, and Arianna Grace; we just needed some Lexis King) and there really wasn't a bad moment. A lot of people said this was the best night of the weekend, and from a pure wrestling standpoint, I think there's definitely a case for that.

I'm not sure the next time we'll get a PLE in Toronto, but I'm 100% going if we get one again anytime soon!

 

[Spiner202]

We are so back!

Sometime in September, Sportsnet removed all historical PPVs. This was in anticipation of them losing WWE rights to Netflix in 2025, but they just pre-emptively removed everything with no warning and continued to take my $15/month.

It's now 2025 and while I haven't scrolled through everything Netflix has, it has the PPV that I left off at (Elimination Chamber 2013), and way more. From what I can tell, there is old stuff here that Sportsnet never had. I think I'm going to continue on chronologically from 2013 until I get to 2023 (where I originally started), and will occasionally sprinkle in random old stuff.

It also has the NXT PLEs, which I will definitely watch at some point too.

 

[VashTheStampede]

Those first few years of NXT...PLEs (that term is just gross to me) are absolute bangers.

 

[Spiner202]

Those first few years of NXT...PLEs (that term is just gross to me) are absolute bangers.

There are some people (Kevin Owens, Finn Balor, Johnny Gargano, Bayley, Asuka, Sasha Banks, etc.) that I've heard are just insane on NXT so I'm really excited to see them. The entirety of the internet seems obsessed with Finn Balor and in the time that I have been watching, I've never seen anything interesting, so I'm hoping this fills in the blanks for me.

 

[VashTheStampede]

Balor is all about aura, really. His matches in that era were pretty good, but even back in New Japan he was never really the most amazing wrestler, IMO.

He was pretty close to his peak in terms of presentation in NXT though. He was easily one of my favorites at that time.

The rest of the ones you named were pretty incredible in that era though, and aside from Sasha, have never matched that level ever since IMO.

Well, except for Owens. That dude peaked in RoH/PWG and still hasn't dropped any. People are going to look back on his career and realize what an insane talent was there from almost day 1.

 

[rktaker]

yeah nxt from 2014-2021 was really good. it’s apparently good now too but I don’t watch so i can’t really say

 

[VashTheStampede]

People seem to enjoy it but it's SO not for me.

 

[Spiner202]

I'm currently at Royal Rumble 2014. I just watched Daniel Bryan lose to Bray Wyatt.

I've had to skip a few 2013 PPVs because Netflix doesn't have them yet, but I did see Summerslam, Battleground, and Hell in a Cell, all of which resulted in Daniel Bryan getting screwed. Honestly, I didn't mind the Summerslam ending. The Battleground one is hilarious in hindsight, but Hell in a Cell was getting ridiculous by that point.

Personally, I am probably not as big of a Daniel Bryan fan as the rest of the internet, but the crowds are absolutely electric for him and it elevates every single one of his matches. I have no idea how he goes from losing to Wyatt to whatever happens at WM30, but I'm excited to see it.