FQ Wolf FQ Wolf Vol. 2 Discussion

[Fire Queen]

ok so i know Vol. 1 just finished but i wanted to go ahead and get this thread rolling because i know a ton of people who were interested in playing didn't get a chance to sign up for the first one. unlike the last game this one will have some more unique roles. sign-ups are going to be open for a while; i have a minor planned surgical procedure the 26th that requires an overnight hospital stay and i don't want to start Vol. 2 beforehand since it will probably run longer on account of i don't plan on capping the number of players in this one and i don't want to have to disappear for like 36 hours lol. i can't say with any certainty when Vol. 2 would start, but let's just say around the end of the month. this way people can also fully focus on Zell 17's upcoming game!

here are some of the unique townie roles we will have:

Seer: the classic. once per night, can PM me the name of any player and will discover that player's role, if any. if the seer targets someone who is also targeted by the wolves, the seer will instead learn the identity of one random wolf. if the seer targets someone who is also targeted by the Vigilante, the seer will instead learn the Vigilante's identity.

Vigilante: one of my favorite roles, the Vigilante has a supply of wolf-killin' bullets but also a heavy conscience. if the Vigilante successfully targets a wolf, the Vigilante can keep killin'. (might cap at three times, we will see). however, if the Vigilante kills an innocent, they won't be able to use their ability anymore and will basically be a regular townie for the rest of the game.

Doctor: another classic. can target one person per night to make sure they do not die. if their target is also a wolf target, the wolf target will remain alive but with scars indicating they were attacked by a wolf. so, they'll know, but no one else will. if the Doctor and the Vigilante target the same person...similar scars will let the person know they were shot. (the Vigilante will still lose their ability in this case.) the Doctor will even save a wolf, given that they'd be none the wiser. if this is confusing don't worry hopefully it doesn't happen

Polycule: i've seen this role group as, like, Masons in other games but come on this way is way funnier. depending on how many players we have this is a group of 3-5 townies who all know each other to be definitively townie. they have no real powers beyond this apart from loving each other very deeply. if they are executed or otherwise killed, their role will only be shown as Townie.

Somnambulist: a very fancy word for sleepwalker. this person cannot be targeted by anyone during any night phase, except the seer. anyone who targets them will learn their role.

Tycoon: having recently come into a great deal of wealth, the Tycoon can bribe the executioner to break a tie. if they die, tie-breakers will be settled in the same way they were settled in the previous game. added wrinkle: if the wolves kill the Tycoon, they gain access to the money and they gain the ability to break ties

Alchemist: this person ain't going down without taking someone with them. the alchemist has been imbibing poisons not lethal enough to kill a human but definitely lethal to anyone of the lupine persuasion. if the Alchemist is targeted by the wolves, one random wolf will die during the following night phase.

lastly, the wolves will be pretty straightforward although there will be one Alpha Wolf. they will be able to make one kill in addition to the regular wolf kill during any one night of their choosing. however, they're also doomed if they target the Alchemist, so be careful!

i may add more as i come up with them, and am also down for feedback! anywho please feel free to join, Vol. 1 was a hoot

Committed players (18):​

- shortkut
- Fool's Requiem
- VashTheStampede
- Warp
- Tommy Boy
- Kat
- Ants!
- Zell 17
- Olga
- Jawneh
- Benzine
- Alu
- Holly
- Local Hero
- Tubby23
- Smacktard
- canadaguy
- TD

 

[shortkut]

I’ll play

 

[Fool's Requiem]

I'm in.

What about a Jester type role, where their whole game is to get lynched, and if they do, they win? But they can be killed at night and if you make it too obvious, no one will vote for you, but wolves can use that to their advantage and act like a Jester, too.

 

[Fire Queen]

I'm in.

What about a Jester type role, where their whole game is to get lynched, and if they do, they win? But they can be killed at night and if you make it too obvious, no one will vote for you, but wolves can use that to their advantage and act like a Jester, too.

that's one i'm considering, yeah. i'm on the fence about unique win conditions but i'll probably warm up to it. if i do the Jester i'm also definitely gonna do Tom and Jerry roles lol

 

[VashTheStampede]

Assuming this doesn't kick off until after Zell's game (or at least after I'm dead in it), I'll play. So tentative yes I guess.

 

[Ryan!]

In

 

[Raine]

I must have vengeance. Or minimally, cookies as compensation.

Put me in, coach!

 

[Tommy Boy]

YERRRRRR

 

[Cole]

I'm a little anxious to play two games at once when I can't guarantee my own activity levels.

but, yeah whatever. gimme wolf again, let's make it a party.

 

[Fire Queen]

this game is still a ways away from starting but i feel now is a good time to mention that role-claiming of any type is Not gonna be allowed in this one lol

also i’ll update the first post later when i’m not on my phone

 

[Cole]

this game is still a ways away from starting but i feel now is a good time to mention that role-claiming of any type is Not gonna be allowed in this one lol

also i’ll update the first post later when i’m not on my phone

again, I get why this would be a thing, but I don't think it's reasonable to say never..

part of the game with roles is eventually being like "fine, you guys won't believe my words, I'm the detective, Vash is a wolf"

that has to be part of a game or the odds tip heavily to the wolves.

 

[VashTheStampede]

I think the wolves should have the odds in their favor though. Basic asymmetrical game design.

 

[Tubby23]

I'll play this one too

 

[Cole]

I think the wolves should have the odds in their favor though. Basic asymmetrical game design.

the wolves ALWAYS have the odds in their favor by nature of having information no one else has. and I agree it SHOULD be that way, I just think this tilts the odds TOO MICH in their favor.

 

[VashTheStampede]

Maybe. But the town having roles is a MASSIVE increase in their chances and I don't think the typical wolf roles are enough to offset.

 

[Cole]

Maybe. But the town having roles is a MASSIVE increase in their chances and I don't think the typical wolf roles are enough to offset.

but it's... not, not unless role revealing is allowed.

having roles does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING if you can never say "I checked Vash last night, he's a wolf", no one needs to believe that, but it is a verifable statement which will have negative consequences for a lie.

alternatively, without role reveals, it's just a normal townie spouting shit with zero reason to trust it

no role reveals immediately ties the hands of the town.

 

[VashTheStampede]

"In studying his posts, I think Cole is a wolf. Here are reasons why:"

Let's say I DON'T convince everyone with my natural charm and unbreakable logic.

A day later, I'm dead. My role is thus revealed as Wolf Checker Guy.

Rest of town thinks, hey maybe the Wolf Checker Guy checked Cole and THATS why he said it.

I'm just saying it's not black and white.

 

[Cole]

"In studying his posts, I think Cole is a wolf. Here are reasons why:"

Let's say I DON'T convince everyone with my natural charm and unbreakable logic.

A day later, I'm dead. My role is thus revealed as Wolf Checker Guy.

Rest of town thinks, hey maybe the Wolf Checker Guy checked Cole and THATS why he said it.

I'm just saying it's not black and white.

of course it's not.

But to that same point, neither is role revealing. there is every possibility I could have lied about my role in the current game. and if I get lynched or merced at night? well I guess we'll find out.

announcing your role, or claiming a role that isn't yours, is a workable strategy.

 

[shortkut]

"In studying his posts, I think Cole is a wolf. Here are reasons why:"

Let's say I DON'T convince everyone with my natural charm and unbreakable logic.

A day later, I'm dead. My role is thus revealed as Wolf Checker Guy.

Rest of town thinks, hey maybe the Wolf Checker Guy checked Cole and THATS why he said it.

I'm just saying it's not black and white.

But that only works if the person with the helpful role is killed, it makes the wolves too powerful as the only way we get concrete information is if a townie is killed

 

[VashTheStampede]

That was just one example. To think that the only way to get information out is by role claiming is such an unimaginative way of looking at things.

 

[Fire Queen]

yeah not to mention in any game where roles get claimed things immediately devolve into arguments over whether role claiming is good gameplay or not. i would just as soon rather not deal with it and force people to be subtle

 

[shortkut]

yeah not to mention in any game where roles get claimed things immediately devolve into arguments over whether role claiming is good gameplay or not. i would just as soon rather not deal with it and force people to be subtle

Your game your rules. Thanks for making it clear beforehand rather than changing thing up after reveals have already happened

 

[Ants!]

Actually seeing this for the first time. I definitely want to play if all the spots aren’t taken yet.

 

[Zell 17]

Thanks for making it clear beforehand rather than changing thing up after reveals have already happened

Listen, motherfucker.

 

[Zell 17]

Also I will join. About the no role claiming. If I'm the seer could I say something like "I have a really really good feeling shortkut is *enter exact role*". Or even as a doctor, "I bet this guy will never die EVER".

 

[shortkut]

Listen, motherfucker.

It wasn’t a deliberate shot at you. It’s we started doing something in your game and then it changed midway forcing us to recalibrate. I know it wasn’t what you intended, but rather than let it fly since the cat is out of the bag, you changed it.

 

[Zell 17]

It wasn’t a deliberate shot at you. It’s we started doing something in your game and then it changed midway forcing us to recalibrate. I know it wasn’t what you intended, but rather than let it fly since the cat is out of the bag, you changed it.

Sometimes when things break unexpectedly you gotta put in a hotfix. In the NCAA world I was at a college football game where they changed the playing rules at halftime. Dude from Pitt faked sliding and the defense let him score a touchdown. The NCAA secretary rules-editor called the officials at halftime and said "Tell the coaches before the second half that if that happens again you are gonna blow the whistle and rule him down".

It became an official rule change before the next season.

 

[shortkut]

Sometimes when things break unexpectedly you gotta put in a hotfix. In the NCAA world I was at a college football game where they changed the playing rules at halftime. Dude from Pitt faked sliding and the defense let him score a touchdown. The NCAA secretary rules-editor called the officials at halftime and said "Tell the coaches before the second half that if that happens again you are gonna blow the whistle and rule him down".

It became an official rule change before the next season.

Fair enough, I see your point

 

[Cole]

yeah not to mention in any game where roles get claimed things immediately devolve into arguments over whether role claiming is good gameplay or not. i would just as soon rather not deal with it and force people to be subtle

I get it. but I just think a blanket "don't reveal" is a bad idea.

a loose encouragement to only reveal outright in a "desperate" situation is better. but as shortkut said, I'll play with whatever rules you have. I'm just chiming in.

 

[Ants!]

I get it. but I just think a blanket "don't reveal" is a bad idea.

a loose encouragement to only reveal outright in a "desperate" situation is better. but as shortkut said, I'll play with whatever rules you have. I'm just chiming in.

I had that idea too. That if you’re in danger of being killed, role-claiming makes more sense.

But if we get into “everyone just tell us what roles you got”, it can break the game dynamic I think. Or at least there’s a danger of it.

 

[Cole]

I had that idea too. That if you’re in danger of being killed, role-claiming makes more sense.

But if we get into “everyone just tell us what roles you got”, it can break the game dynamic I think. Or at least there’s a danger of it.

I agree (sort of), but I do believe it can't be a straight up "never do it", it's not viable. why even have roles?

 

[Ants!]

I know it’s a hard thing to restrict. Not only are there conflicting opinions on “should you”, but also questions of how you would go about it, what’s allowed and what’s not, and if you can even enforce it.

It’s a conversation worth having. And we play a different version of wolf each time, there can be role-claiming games and non-role-claiming games.

To answer your question of why even have roles though, they would still serve a purpose because when a players role is revealed at death, it shines a new light on all of their previous posts, so it’s still useful. You could also still allow DMs between players (not sure how you could enforce prohibition on that anyway). So information-gathering roles can message members they checked or want to risk confiding in.

Not sure if that makes things better or worse, but a conversation on the specifics is worth having I think.

 

[Olga]

Can I still join???

 

[Tommy Boy]

Can I still join???

Yes.

I'm not in charge but yes.

 

[Benzine]

yes pls

 

[Fire Queen]

yeah! signups are gonna be open for the next couple weeks prolly

 

[Jawneh]

Alrighty, since this is going to start a bit later, I'll throw my hat in.

 

[A Punched Face]

I'll join as well

 

[Ryan!]

An interesting role I've thought of is a Medium type townie role. They know who every single Wolf is. The Wolves do not know who they are. The Medium cannot be protected. It makes it so they have to try and find ways to convince the town who the bad guys are without giving themselves away, since they'll obvious be the first target.

 

[Zell 17]

An interesting role I've thought of is a Medium type townie role. They know who every single Wolf is. The Wolves do not know who they are. The Medium cannot be protected. It makes it so they have to try and find ways to convince the town who the bad guys are without giving themselves away, since they'll obvious be the first target.

What's stopping them from just outing all the wolves day 1? My strategy there would be to basically quote all four wolves in each post and then get myself killed, once everyone knows who I am it should be a mop up victory.

 

[Ryan!]

What's stopping them from just outing all the wolves day 1? My strategy there would be to basically quote all four wolves in each post and then get myself killed, once everyone knows who I am it should be a mop up victory.

I hadn't thought about that. Perhaps a caveat about psychic energy overloading so if they do all of that the town instantly loses or something.

 

[Ants!]

I hadn't thought about that. Perhaps a caveat about psychic energy overloading so if they do all of that the town instantly loses or something.

Just sounds like they’ll look for ways to drop hints and skirt the rules to still try to out the wolves more subtly. Either it’s broken and you’re just giving the town a win, or they can’t say anything and it’s a worthless role.

Just do the work to figure out who the wolves are.

 

[Fire Queen]

there was a role similar to that in the GW-themed game i ran a while back (the Al/Gamewinners.com role) and it basically broke the game entirely yeah

 

[Cole]

completely spitballing and trying to thinking roles I'd personally find fun with.

what about a role that has way too much information but is somehow limited on posting? can only post once a day, can only vote. posts can only be x words long. stuff like thst.

those are not gonna work. since every one would know that's the role, but if they weren't strictly pro town or pro wolf, there could be something

 

[Zell 17]

Oh man I've got tons of roles. Still thinking about what I want to run for my next game. Balance is the key. For wolves I like the Cursed role. The cursed doesn't know who the wolves are and the wolves don't know who the cursed is. The cursed shows as a good villager. But if the cursed is attacked, they turn into another wolf. They only win with the wolves.

 

[Cole]

Oh man I've got tons of roles. Still thinking about what I want to run for my next game. Balance is the key. For wolves I like the Cursed role. The cursed doesn't know who the wolves are and the wolves don't know who the cursed is. The cursed shows as a good villager. But if the cursed is attacked, they turn into another wolf. They only win with the wolves.

similar idea:

what about a different take on the fool. the fool thinks he's a werewolf, he knows the other wolves, but the wolves don't know who he is. the fools job is to try and win with the wolves basically by taking one for the team.

if he gets killed (lynched or assassinated) before any wolves, maybe the wolves get some kind of bonus action? or even just the fool wins if he gets killed "for" the wolves?

 

[Zell 17]

There’s another “voting role” similar to the fool called the headhunter. The headhunter is given a target at the beginning of the game. If that target gets lynched, they win. Target obviously cannot be evil.

 

[Jawneh]

I've toyed with the idea of modifiers for any given day. Like, the person who posts the most/least dies, the person with the second most votes gets lynched instead, every with more than 1 vote dies, you may only post in single sentences and no double posting or you die, any order of the letters "and" needs to be turned into "nads" or you die. If you want to soften the blow a little bit, death can be swapped with role reveal so there's still a chance if too many people screw up.

I'm sure people could easily come up with another few dozen easily and then pull out a random modifier for any given day or even night. Just throw in a good number of "normal" days in the hat as well unless you want every day to be special.

 

[Ryan!]

I remember one insane Wolf game where every single person had roles with insane stipulations and for some reason there were five people that were part of the Voltron Force.

 

[Zell 17]

Another powerful wolf role is the confusion wolf. They can, twice at night, activate an ability that will hide roles from all dead players for that night. Wolves would see the role. Villagers would just be told that XXX was killed, not what role they had.