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Multi Cheating in video games

Smacktard

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How do you guys feel about cheating in video games? Online, offline, whatever -- what are your thoughts?

Online I'm obviously against it unless it's friends screwing around in a private server.

Offline I'm okay with it. Some games have insane challenges and I just can't afford to spend dozens and dozens of hours trying to complete something when there's a glitch that can speed up the process.

Take Hollow Knight for example. If you want to 100% that game, you're going to have to put in at least 30 hours into the boss rush mode of the game alone. I just couldn't stomach that, and was starting to hate a game I loved, so I discovered an invulnerability glitch and cleared the game that way. Not even ashamed of it.

You can say it cheapens the victory, and that may be true, but it also doesn't bother me that much -- especially if I feel like the challenge is just outlandishly or unfairly difficult.
 

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Online - won't do it, anything where you interact with others, there's leader boards, whatever, npt going to affect anyone else's experience if I can't enjoy the game as is.

Offline - if it helps you enjoy the game a bit more or is enough to push you into having fun with it, go for it.

On console I don't really have the option but the closest thing I can compare to actually cheating is Rogue Legacy 2 that has built in modifiers. I loved the game but I found it hard but I'm not super into roguelites so I used the built in stuff to make it a bit easier.
 

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video games game genie GIF
 

TD

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I also think accessibility in games is important and games have gotten good at that.

I'll use Elden Ring as an example.

Souls purists (terrible fan base btw) will look down on people who use summons, cheese methods, or whatever.

Whereas really, as long as they aren't impacting others - who cares what tools they use as long as they enjoy the game.
 

Smacktard

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On console I don't really have the option but the closest thing I can compare to actually cheating is Rogue Legacy 2 that has built in modifiers
Will You Snail? and Rain World both have in-game modifiers that can make the experience easier. I played as much as I was willing with these turned off, but if the challenge/tedium got to be too much, I didn't mind switching them on.

In Will You Snail? you can modify the game speed. I played some levels at 50% speed because that shit was impossible otherwise.
 
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Will You Snail? and Rain World both have in-game modifiers that can make the experience easier. I played as much as I was willing with these turned off, but if the challenge/tedium got to be too much, I didn't mind switching them on.
I wish more games would do stuff like this. It can help lure in people who are willing to experiment with genres that have a completely different learning curve from what they're used to.
Absolutely not online, but offline yeah, go for it.

And where can you find the greatest collection of video game cheats? Why GameWinners.com('s archive.org pages)!
Smooth Segway.
 

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I don't think I have a hard and fast blanket rule when it comes to cheating, honestly. And what qualifies as cheating is... nebulous at best, and I find that my views differ pretty wildly when compared to the "average" player/overall community sentiment game-to-game.

My default example will just always be Final Fantasy XI. It's an online game, so "cheating" should be avoided in theory... but also, the way the game is designed and the tools that Square Enix provides seldom entwine properly. So like FFXI is all about horizontal gear progression (sidegrades/alternatives instead of upgrades) and super niche/very specific gear buffs, so you have say dozens of rings in your inventory - some have Strength, some have Attack Power, some have "Conserve Resources" (not what it's called, but what it does), some have Speed (Haste, which stacks) and what you want while auto-attacking, while casting a spell, while standing idle, while in a defensive state are all different. And the game originally let you use text commands (macros) to change equipment mid-fight, on the fly, whenever you wanted - there's even a debuff in the game that specifically makes it so you can't change gear (Encumbrance) - but macros can only accept 6 lines and there are 16 gear slots.

So, enter third-party program Windower that allows in-game macros/commands to call Windower macros, thereby allowing for infinite lines of text commands, and its add-on Gearswap that lets you literally create and execute code (in the form of .lua files) in-game, automating the gear changing. The exact point this becomes "cheating" varies greatly person to person, but here's the rub: Without using Gearswap, there are mountains of items in the game that are worthless. You would never realistically be able to make proper use of so many stats, and it would fundamentally undermine a lot of what makes FFXI appealing. There are plenty of proponents that say these restrictions - like the restrictions that led to many classic video games existing as they do - themselves breed and foster creativity. And, sure, there's some logic in that. But FFXI is also an MMO and so for most of its existence you could not feasibly expect to ever actually get your hands on many powerful pieces of gear, or it would take months or years to acquire them. And so that "creativity" runs into the brick wall of RNG, whereas Gearswap enables you to swap in pieces - even dangerous ones (vastly lower level, no defense stat, etc) - and hodgepodge yourself into fighting form.


Generally, I don't care what other people do in their own games. You want to blatantly hack and break the game, be it Game Genie or Cheat Engine? Knock yourself out. I don't even super care if people cheat online, provided whatever they're doing doesn't affect my account or compromise my console/PC/account's security. If someone's cheating in a lobby, I'll just exit the lobby. No big deal.

But me, personally, I can't be bothered to cheat most of the time. There are glitches/exploits for Guitar Hero 2, for example, that functionally let you swap note charts between songs - so if someone were so inclined, they could pop the achievement for beating the song "Jordan" on Expert while actually playing "Sweet Child o' Mine" or something. I won't do that because I want to accomplish things on my own, I don't care if I'm never good enough to accomplish it, and I hold actual disdain for true "achievement whores" that 1) buy and play obvious shit and shovelware exclusively to inflate their GamerScore and 2) think their imaginary epeen numbers mean anything. Achievements/Trophies are fun to compare with friends because then you can share war stories with one another at a glance. If you don't have the stories, then I personally don't see the point. :shrug

But... I also don't know that "I spent 6 1/2 consecutive hours playing Rock Band 2 without pausing, opening the console guide or my batteries dying and without failing a song" is something developers should encourage or rely upon. I did it, I mean, because I'm stupid and had enough free time. It's blatantly unhealthy though. And there's no real difference between me talking into a microphone for ~30 hours, or me duct taping said microphone to a window fan, turning that fun on high, and letting the game auto-play itself for ~30 hours to earn One Million Fake Munnies for an achievement worth 30 GS while I actually play a different game elsewhere.
 
Maybe it's because I'm a console gamer, but my view is that if the game lets you do it, it's fine. This feels especially true in the current era where devs can patch things out of games. Obviously there are constraints on what is fixable, but if the devs don't make a concerted effort to fix a glitch or exploit, I don't have a problem with it.

I don't really believe in using external tools or hacking/modding games though.
 
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It's sometimes fun to use mods and cheat in single player games, but I don't dare try it with online games. I've heard a lot about players getting banned in MMO's for doing it such as Guild Wars 2. They delete your account and ban your IP.
 

VashTheStampede

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I don't have a moral issue with cheating in single player environments but it doesn't appeal to me.

Used to love it as a kid with the Game Genie and such but maybe I burned out on it then.

On the one hand, I get frustrated with games like Elden Ring because they are just a LITTLE bit too hard for me to enjoy fully. But the idea of cheating to do better in it is somehow just as unappealing. Difficulty settings would be preferable. Weird.
 

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On the one hand, I get frustrated with games like Elden Ring because they are just a LITTLE bit too hard for me to enjoy fully. But the idea of cheating to do better in it is somehow just as unappealing. Difficulty settings would be preferable. Weird.
All soulsborne games are the same though. Designed to be hard, almost impossible, early. But NG+, you feel like a god. If you haven't, go back and play NG+, you'll enjoy it far more when you absolutely annihilate Margit.
 

VashTheStampede

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All soulsborne games are the same though. Designed to be hard, almost impossible, early. But NG+, you feel like a god. If you haven't, go back and play NG+, you'll enjoy it far more when you absolutely annihilate Margit.
The fact that you think I've ever beaten one is very nice of you
 

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On the one hand, I get frustrated with games like Elden Ring because they are just a LITTLE bit too hard for me to enjoy fully.
If you ever want to give it another shot, I'd be happy to help you out with tips or advice.

It's a great game but there are barriers for those not used to Souls games, ER is far and away the most accessible (and imo easiest) Souls game.
 
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The fact that you think I've ever beaten one is very nice of you
That's fair... Elden Ring was the first time I FINISHED a soulsborne game. The visuals were so incredibly stunning (thank you Peter Jackson). I almost quit int he first couple hours. But I'm VERY happy I stuck it out. I got addicted to the game and can't wait for the next.
 

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If you ever want to give it another shot, I'd be happy to help you out with tips or advice.

It's a great game but there are barriers for those not used to Souls games, ER is far and away the most accessible (and imo easiest) Souls game.
ER is the one I spent by far the most time with but I still hit a wall and failing to climb that wall eventually felt un-fun.

I still think about reinstalling every so often because the moments I liked were excellent.
 
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ER is the one I spent by far the most time with but I still hit a wall and failing to climb that wall eventually felt un-fun.

I still think about reinstalling every so often because the moments I liked were excellent.
Do you recall how far you got?

I would obviously highly recommend Elden Ring but I'm probably the biggest Souls fanboy here.
 

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Do you recall how far you got?

I would obviously highly recommend Elden Ring but I'm probably the biggest Souls fanboy here.
I know that by design in that game, if you get stuck on one thing you can just go somewhere else and explore, so technically I was stuck in a couple spots but the boss fight that eventually made me throw in the towel was against the two Valiant Gargoyles.

Couldn't even execute the cheese strat lol
 
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Fuck, I'm sorry, George RR Martin, NOT Peter Jackson....
Yeah, GRRM was involved but had nothing to do with visuals. That was Miyazaki and his team.

Martin was responsible for a decent portion of the lore, characters, and item descriptions though.

That's a big reason so many characters start with G, R, or M.
 

TD

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I know that by design in that game, if you get stuck on one thing you can just go somewhere else and explore, so technically I was stuck in a couple spots but the boss fight that eventually made me throw in the towel was against the two Valiant Gargoyles.

Couldn't even execute the cheese strat lol
So this may help you feel better, especially being a Souls vet.

On my first blind playthrough I got stuck at the Gargoyles and came back way later. I realized I was objectively underleveled and my weapon was not upgraded nearly enough.
 
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