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Industry The Impending Death of Physical Releases

Raine

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So this is a little bit of an ad-hoc story, at present largely circling around Microsoft and the Xbox platform. However the industry does love its trends and even though Xbox is in a distant third place two generations running, one of the console holders having little to no presence in retail stores or online marketplaces like Amazon will impact the others. How something like an Xbox stand with consoles, controllers and gift cards - but no games - would resonate with your average shopper, particularly during the holidays, is also an interesting consideration.

But we're getting a little ahead of ourselves here, so let's back it up a bit. As part of their legal struggles with acquiring Activision-Blizzard-King, an enormous amount of confidential data relating to Xbox was inadvertently leaked. Some of it was funny, like the amount of money Microsoft thought they would need to pay some publishers/developers to get specific games onto Game Pass. The most amusing being Larian's Baldur's Gate 3, which Microsoft thought would only cost them $5m. In comparison they believed Dragon Ball: The Breakers would be $20m and Lego Star Wars would be $35m. This, in turn, has definitely fueled journalists asking Larian's boss questions - and Larian's boss, Swen Vincke, not pulling punches.

Others were more insightful, like the revelation that 2024 was set to see "refreshes" of both the Series S and the Series X - and neither would be offering optical disc drives. This could then effectively present a scenario in which no new Xbox consoles available as new purchases would have the ability to play disc games, striking a massive blow to hobbyists that can currently play many games from all generations of Xbox consoles by simply inserting their disc to start a digital download (which requires the disc to serve as a key to boot up, but is then otherwise not used). A decent assortment of games simply aren't - or weren't - available to purchase digitally to begin with and persist only through physical media. Which will then be exacerbated further this July with the full closure of the Xbox 360 Marketplace.

Despite the source of the leak being official documents submitted to the FTC, some remained skeptical that Microsoft would actually follow through with these plans. Physical media for Sony's consoles, for example, still accounts for roughly 50% of early adoption (read: full price) sales worldwide. Additionally, many ISPs still impose data caps and circa 2021 roughly 4% of the households in the USA that reported not using the internet, did so because it still wasn't available in their area. Some math for context there: As of 2023 there were 131.43 million US households; the 2021 report says roughly 24 million (18.26%) didn't have internet in general and ~960k (0.73%) didn't have access. That's a significant market to abandon.

And if that were the entirety of the news from last year, perhaps that would have borne out. But it wasn't. In October, Best Buy announced that they would cease carrying all forms of physical media for movies. This came roughly 5 years after they stopped carrying music CDs. It was clarified that they would continue to carry physical video games, for now, however their brick and mortar offerings have been fairly anemic and their online storefront routinely clearances games - even high-profile AAA games that are only a few years old. Rumors immediately sprung up about other retailers dropping physical media, and yesterday Twitter was abuzz with news that Walmart is set to remove physical Xbox games. Beginning with Starfield, Microsoft's flagship title for 2023.

Another of Xbox's very few notable first-party exclusives, Hellblade II: Senua's Saga, was also just announced for a May 21st release date. It is to be a digital-only release priced at $49.99. How much of this has to do with the absolute embarrassment of last year's Redfall, or because Hellblade II allegedly only has an 8-hour runtime, remains to be seen. Still... there is an awful, awful lot of smoke here for there not to be a fire of sorts afoot. And as an opinion piece on Kotaku points out, it's not just Microsoft themselves that are part of this trend. Alan Wake II is digital-only, and while Baldur's Gate 3 has a physical release in the works it was not there at any stage of its staggered launch. Further it is inevitable that, after the July closure of the Xbox 360 Marketplace, Sony will resume with their closure of the PlayStation Store on PS3 and Vita in fairly short order. Will they follow suit with physical as well, particularly now that the PS5 Slim has a(n optional) detachable disc drive?


Most importantly. Am I the only one here bummed the fuck out by all this? As I've shared over the months, the physical collection my partner and I have is vast. And while we're not opposed to digital goods - most of our movies and music are digital, and it's actually debatable whether our digital games selection for Xbox is bigger than our physical collection - we do vastly prefer physical discs that we can move around. Even in this modern era where physical releases are of dubious quality, or glorified keys because you install nothing/very little and most of it is a download anyway.

Where do y'all land on this one? How would your playing/spending habits change, if at all?
 
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Lunar Kreskents

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Man I almost never buy games that are digital download only. Possibly that's because I mostly play large long games like RPGs so having the disc feels.... important somehow, though I guess it isn't. I also regularly peruse my collection of physical games and play those. Not having a bunch of ads in my face and not dealing with a clunky platform UI makes gaming feel a lot more enjoyable.

So yeah, I'm not sure what will happen for me.. I'll definitely be a lot more hesitant to buy new games without a physical copy. And I've already become pretty hesitant as I grow older because I have less time and money and I like modern games less and less. At least if I have a physical copy and it's a bust i feel like I can sell it or keep it on my shelf as a collectible/house decoration basically. :thinking

Edit: I also do not do gaming subscription services, and I don't really play games multiplayer online, except for very rare and timeboxed instances.
 

TD

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I hate this whole digital-only stuff and personally feel like it is anti-consumer.

It won't affect me too much as I so seldomly buy games nowadays, but one of the biggest benefits of physical media has always been the ability to sell, lend, or trade the games.

It's bad enough I have no access to rental, but demos are no longer common place, and games are insanely expensive. If you end up buying a digital game you don't like, nothing you can do. At least with physical, you can flip it.

I actually sold my PS4 games to help me afford a PS5 (first time I've ever sold), I used to collect games but it's just so costly to be a collector now when I could use the money. I do still have all my games from SNES-PS3 but it's likely a matter of time until I sell those.

That said, digital media sucks.
 

Lunar Kreskents

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I hadn't even thought about the whole lending and trading aspect, which yeah, as a kid when I played games a lot I used to do all the time. Or even just bringing my game along to someone else's house to play together. I don't hate multiplayer, if I'm going to do it I want to sit in a room with the person, it's a shared experience thing. That's why I don't play multiplayer online. Ironically the one time I do, I drive 1.5 hours to a "LAN" party where we play Starcraft "online" (but all together, in person, like the old days) once a year or so.
 
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Almost every game I buy nowadays is digital, but mainly out of laziness/impatience and the fact that half of them are PC games. I kind of hate it though, because I know in the back of my mind that it's temporary. Companies have been ending their online services way too early for my liking, so I know that if my Switch ever dies it will probably be long after the point where I can redownload my games. As much as I hate to get off my ass and swap games, the idea of video games eventually going fully digital saddens me. It's already hard enough to find old Nintendo games legally and without paying $100+. Good luck finding old Pokemon games once those games don't exist in physical form.

Movies are a completely different story. I rarely ever buy movies in general, but the only digital one I own is The Emperor's New Groove for I think my PS3. If it's being saved to a gaming console, I'm less wary, but I just don't have faith in the longevity of whatever service people are buying movies digitally with currently. Seems like a waste of money. If I'm watching something, it's either going to be on a streaming service or a disc.

Music I couldn't care less. I'm not a music guy, and I haven't bought a CD since I was a kid. As long as the internet exists, it will always be readily available somewhere.
 

Raine

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Possibly that's because I mostly play large long games like RPGs so having the disc feels.... important somehow, though I guess it isn't.
I feel you on this. Big part of why I greatly dislike games not having physical manuals for the past decade or so, as well. It's somewhat of a "waste" for most games and genres, but like... RPGs are different. Having something physical to hold, play around with, maybe there's a map on the back of the boxart or in the manual. Maybe there's a literal map included alongside the manual. I miss that.

I absolutely put in an order for that physical Baldur's Gate 3 release the moment I saw it. So much nostalgic tat I'll (probably) never use, but I need it. :giggle

It won't affect me too much as I so seldomly buy games nowadays, but one of the biggest benefits of physical media has always been the ability to sell, lend, or trade the games.
That's a big thing, yeah. Even now it's important if you look at, say, Netflix and them bringing down the hammer on account sharing. If the games industry expects us to pay $140 for two copies of a digital-only game? So we can both continue to enjoy our RPGs across the office, the living room and the bedroom? Fuck outta here, y'know?

And I can't resell games years down the line if a collector wants something I have and I have a newer, adequate copy? Or I can't let one of my nephews take a game home with them to enjoy when they come over to visit? ...I definitely wouldn't have bought 3 copies of Shredder's Revenge and The Cowabunga Collection if there weren't physical editions available. Nuh-uh, no way. Not without a deep, deep discount at the very least!
 

Raine

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Operation: Smaller post length! ...Sort of. Smaller quotes when hitting reply at least. 🤣

It's already hard enough to find old Nintendo games legally and without paying $100+. Good luck finding old Pokemon games once those games don't exist in physical form.
Shit, good luck finding legitimate/non-counterfeit copies of the GB/C/A and DS games now. A good 6~7 years ago I had to go around to various GameStop locations instructing them on how to spot counterfeits. ...Not because I worked there. Because I kept ordering copies from the website and more than half of what I got was fake. 😂

Music I couldn't care less. I'm not a music guy, and I haven't bought a CD since I was a kid. As long as the internet exists, it will always be readily available somewhere.
Music definitely feels like it's the safest, just because the files are so small and have been so readily available for so long and in so many places. I'm still able to, say, find extraordinarily niche language-specific covers of songs from video games and animes that never had anything remotely approaching a "proper" release. B-Sides, Demos, one-off collaborations - someone's got a copy somewhere, and until YouTube, Vimeo, et al, shutter it's not terribly difficult to track down.

It's rare that I like an entire album or discography enough to want to own the whole thing, anyway. Really there's only two bands I've followed/cared about enough to bother with. And I own their stuff digitally as well.
 
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TD

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That's a big thing, yeah. Even now it's important if you look at, say, Netflix and them bringing down the hammer on account sharing. If the games industry expects us to pay $140 for two copies of a digital-only game? So we can both continue to enjoy our RPGs across the office, the living room and the bedroom? Fuck outta here, y'know?

And I can't resell games years down the line if a collector wants something I have and I have a newer, adequate copy? Or I can't let one of my nephews take a game home with them to enjoy when they come over to visit? ...I definitely wouldn't have bought 3 copies of Shredder's Revenge and The Cowabunga Collection if there weren't physical editions available. Nuh-uh, no way. Not without a deep, deep discount at the very least!
Definitely - but interesting that you say Netflix as I worked at Blockbuster as a teenager. I'll never forget the district manager scoffing at the idea of rent from home type of ideas and the internet ever competing. He was convinced that the desire of the experience of going to Blockbuster would win out, shows what he knew.

Anyhow my point is - this has sadly always been a case of when and not if. It'll be cheaper for them and more costly for us.

It feels like them just trying to kill resale and third party markets where they aren't getting a cut.
 

Raine

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Definitely - but interesting that you say Netflix as I worked at Blockbuster as a teenager. I'll never forget the district manager scoffing at the idea of rent from home type of ideas and the internet ever competing. He was convinced that the desire of the experience of going to Blockbuster would win out, shows what he knew.
Twice over, even, and both from the same company! :chuckle

I do still vaguely miss physical rentals as an experience, but... I think that's probably just nostalgia for old games and cheap playing options more than anything. Honestly the idea of driving over to pick up and return games in a timely manner sounds a bit off-putting right now. 🤔

It feels like them just trying to kill resale and third party markets where they aren't getting a cut.
100% that. For better or worse, GameStop really was the floodgates holding back that deluge of shit. They were bad in their own ways, but for ages GameStop not carrying your game(s) meant your game was definitely going to perform badly. So there was some level of give and take there, and that's something the likes of Best Buy, Walmart and Amazon don't have. I mean hell, Amazon has had beef with Nintendo for a decade and routinely didn't directly carry their devices - and that did absolutely nothing to slow the Wii, (3)DS and Switch down.

I still vividly remember the talking heads trying to compare used games to piracy. And that eventually leading knobs like EA's then-CEO John Riccitiello (also of recent Unity infamy) pushing the microtransactions to try and "convert" used (/pirated) players into "paying" ones. Shit like FIFA Ultimate Team, essentially, being byproducts of that. As well as the dreadful Online Pass shtick.
 
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TD

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I do still vaguely miss physical rentals as an experience, but... I think that's probably just nostalgia for old games and cheap playing options more than anything. Honestly the idea of driving over to pick up and return games in a timely manner sounds a bit off-putting right now. 🤔
I would still love to be able to rent games, picking up and returning isn't even a deterrent for me.

There's definitely an element of nostalgia to rentals, like without a doubt because it was also like THE WAY to try new games for so long.

That and I have fond PS1 memories when I would rent a game and buy a blank cd with it.
 

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I'm going to fall on this topic differently from everyone I think.

I don't care. This has clearly been the trendline for awhile now and it's not surprising.

And I'm sorry to say, every time I've owned physical media it's been a pain. It eventually becomes obsolete. We have a huge box of our old games in our closet and they remain untouched. I'd have to pull out the old console, hope it works, for them to be played.

I remember when my dad finally converted his huge stash of family VHS tapes. When he first recorded them, he maybe had the image of us watching them one day and recalling memories. But soon, none of us owned a VHS player. Plus the tape can degrade over time.

Resell markets. Well, whenever I bought a pre-owned disc, I had to be careful of looking for scratches etc. The original owner probably claimed whatever code that came with the game to get the extra Day 1 item or whatever. Buying pre-owned has actually never been a great experience for me. Also not even pre-owned, sometimes my own games would eventually get a scratch and become unplayable.

Trading with friends. I don't do that anymore now that I'm grown up. Also, thinking about my sons. I can't imagine this anymore because parents are clued in, right or wrong, and I don't know what the other parent permits. I have to be careful about letting a different kid play a game my son owns.

I do wonder what GameStop will do. I still remember waiting at midnight there for a release I was looking forward. Sometime special about that experience, that won't happen anymore. I do think they have prepared better than Blockbuster with their gradual shift to all things "geeky" with toys, apparel, etc. Don't know if that's enough to survive.

I'll also always remember when my husband and I merged our two households, and therefore we merged our video game collection. For lifelong gamers that felt like a big moment!

PS - what is the forum policy on emulation discussion?
 
I'm going to fall on this topic differently from everyone I think.

I don't care. This has clearly been the trendline for awhile now and it's not surprising.
I'm with you here. Adding to your points, I'm surprised how much I enjoy not changing discs anymore, and, at least on Playstation, games are usually cheaper digitally. I suspect the great deals may disappear if the industry ever goes fully digital, but my limited knowledge of PC gaming suggests that isn't the case.

I know this opinion is in direct contrast to my thoughts on music, but I think it's because music has lost all value to the average person, so I like the idea of physical media to keep it alive. By contrast, while video games are emulated/gotten for free somewhat frequently, this method of playing games has by no means the market penetration that music does. And even the gaming streaming services aren't as dominant as the music streaming ones.
 

Raine

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I do wonder what GameStop will do. I still remember waiting at midnight there for a release I was looking forward. Sometime special about that experience, that won't happen anymore. I do think they have prepared better than Blockbuster with their gradual shift to all things "geeky" with toys, apparel, etc. Don't know if that's enough to survive.
Definitely don't think it's enough, and even with the craziness from a couple years back I'm kind of shocked they're still hanging in there now. The brick and mortars are pretty desolate whenever I drop by, and the online storefront is probably the most unhelpful and insufferable thing ever. Anyone looking to actually shop, instead of buying a single recent-ish AAA title or two, is just going to close the tab and buy it elsewhere. Some games can only be picked up at the store, but the tracker is busted. Some games can only be purchased as a "Same Day" delivery through a gig economy thing, with like a $15 shipping charge that can't be avoided.

And finally, some small number of games are actually available for just buying the damn thing and having it shipped to you. You know, like a normal store. How the fuck did they get this so wrong? :rofl

I'll also always remember when my husband and I merged our two households, and therefore we merged our video game collection. For lifelong gamers that felt like a big moment!
Haha, yes! It absolutely is.

And honestly... that's where a lot of our problems begin. When dealing with digital downloads it's just a massive pain because we each had preexisting accounts with different purchases. Logically, we have the consoles in the living room set as the primaries for both accounts. So either of us, or any guests (so again, realistically, the nephews), can play whatever they want there no problem. Buuut our PCs aren't in the living room, they're in the office. And we have consoles in there, so digital games are hit or miss since on non-primary consoles you can only access things your account owns and only so long as you're on and remain connected to the internet. Get a stutter, for example, and you could very well lose progress. Same deal for the bedroom, though less so since both accounts can just be logged in there while faffing about before bed.

There's just something wrong about physical being easier in our (admittedly non-standard) situation. I assume it would be even more of a mess if we had kids and they were also gaming enthusiasts. :shake

PS - what is the forum policy on emulation discussion?
We ain't got no advertisers to bow to, so anything goes. Except, like TD said, linking since that could put us in some hot water if anyone ever noticed.

WHAT - how is this a thing??

:chuckle :chuckle
The fuckin' wild west, man! Devs getting away with murder back in the day. 😂
 
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Smacktard

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The most amusing being Larian's Baldur's Gate 3, which Microsoft thought would only cost them $5m. In comparison they believed Dragon Ball: The Breakers would be $20m and Lego Star Wars would be $35m
Lmao Microsoft execs really have NO idea at all, do they? Me and my wife discussed this before. She's of the opinion that a competent CEO of a video game company doesn't need to know about video games -- they just need to be a good leader and know how to listen to advice from people that do. I'm of the opinion that the CEO needs to be a gamer. Otherwise, you wouldn't know which advice is good. $20m for Dragon Ball? $5m for Baldur's? That's just comical.
Others were more insightful, like the revelation that 2024 was set to see "refreshes" of both the Series S and the Series X - and neither would be offering optical disc drives. This could then effectively present a scenario in which no new Xbox consoles available as new purchases would have the ability to play disc games
So, I only learned recently that the current Xbox is backwards-compatible with all previous gens. I'm not a huge Xbox fan, but even I can find value in owning one console that plays the previous 3 console gem's games, too. There's not TOO many exclusives I'd want, but I'm considering getting one with a disc drive to play the Xbox Ninja Gaiden games, and maybe Fable or something. I guess I should strike fast before they're all replaced.
hobbyists that can currently play many games from all generations of Xbox consoles by simply inserting their disc to start a digital download (which requires the disc to serve as a key to boot up, but is then otherwise not used)
So that's how it works! I'm guessing there are some games that are not compatible, or don't run well or something though, right? How has your experience been with this?
Shit, good luck finding legitimate/non-counterfeit copies of the GB/C/A and DS games now. A good 6~7 years ago I had to go around to various GameStop locations instructing them on how to spot counterfeits. ...Not because I worked there. Because I kept ordering copies from the website and more than half of what I got was fake. 😂
Jeeeez, how can you even spot counterfeit games like this?
 

Raine

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I'm surprised how much I enjoy not changing discs anymore, and, at least on Playstation, games are usually cheaper digitally. I suspect the great deals may disappear if the industry ever goes fully digital, but my limited knowledge of PC gaming suggests that isn't the case.
Really depends on what (types of) games you're looking at. And, also depending, when you're looking. There's definitely always sales going on, and you'll usually see popular AAA games for cheap eventually. But as a recent example (and regionally, obviously, RIP Canadialand), you could easily get Assassin's Creed: Mirage for $35 physically whereas the digital version just remained at $50. Conversely, physical copies of more niche games - like we'll go with any random "Atelier" game published by Koei - may retain a high price. Or, if it had a low print, become very expensive. Whereas the digital version, while not necessarily cheap or on sale, is the better price.

PC gaming may or may not be a good comparison depending on how things shake out. Steam, GMG, Humble, Epic, gray/black market stuff like CDKeys or G2A - there's a lot of competition. But for PlayStation and Xbox (or, Baphomet forbid, Nintendo lol), their walled gardens are their own. So if they don't want to lower prices, and there's nothing competing with them to incentivize or force their hand, well... it might not go so well for the enthusiasts. Sony and Microsoft are both leaders in the dubious category of unceremoniously shutting down their own first-party games' online modes/servers on the regular, after all.
 
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Smacktard

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As for digital vs physical...

I'm pretty much physical only. My exception is my Steam account, which I think offers stability, but I still almost never play games on Steam or on my PC. I've had experiences with online shops shutting down, gating access to games that you already own. In the case of Wii, if your console fails and you need a replacement, all of the money you spent on the online shop is gone.

Outside of Steam, I only buy physical games. I don't mind switching carts or switching discs. I only tend to play one game at a time, so it's no hassle. Plus, I like owning the game, the disc/cart, the box art, and the occasional physical stuff included with certain games (manuals, maps -- admittedly more rare nowadays).

I see it as only a matter of time before physical starts disappearing completely. Microsoft is clearly pushing for that. Nintendo I can see holding out for a while -- not because they're especially pro-consumer, but because they're more, um, "traditional" in some ways. Sony will just be led by the nose wherever the other two companies guide them.

I don't think the concern is about reselling. Most resales nowadays are for previous gen consoles. I think the bigger concern for game companies is absolving publishers of the cost of manufacturing and shipping boxes, labels, CDs, which would allow the console producers to demand an even bigger cut.

Anyway, long story short: physical for life, baby
 

Raine

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Otherwise, you wouldn't know which advice is good. $20m for Dragon Ball? $5m for Baldur's? That's just comical.
Yup. Just "any competent CEO" at face value knows that Lego, Star Wars and Dragon Ball are old, beloved franchises. They do not necessarily know, nor understand, that the Dragon Ball game is a radical departure from more normal entries (Budokai, et al) and may not draw as many eyes or attention as usual. They would also not see the name Larian Studios and necessarily associate that with quality and mass appeal, even if they had the data in front of them from their subordinates showing more upward trajectory with the Original Sin games.

There's a certain amount of guesswork involved regardless, but it's definitely hard to look at someone like Satoru Iwata and not feel like there's a world of difference between him and Phil Spencer. ...Which, Phil Spencer is also infinitely better than Jim Ryan so that's not necessarily a complete dig either. Spencer does at least sometimes play games, in the way that Reggie Fils-Amie did/does. :chuckle

Good leaders do absolutely understand what they do and don't know though, and great leaders know how to find and enable people that do to thrive under them. Microsoft... definitely lacks a lot of that. And has since at bare minimum 2009. If they truly had it before then, or just had a series of flukes, is up for debate.

So, I only learned recently that the current Xbox is backwards-compatible with all previous gens. I'm not a huge Xbox fan, but even I can find value in owning one console that plays the previous 3 console gem's games, too. There's not TOO many exclusives I'd want, but I'm considering getting one with a disc drive to play the Xbox Ninja Gaiden games, and maybe Fable or something. I guess I should strike fast before they're all replaced.
You can pick up used Xbox One Slims and Xbox One X's for reasonably cheap, if nothing else. We have the Series X and honestly there still isn't very much available for that that's worthwhile - and absolutely nothing, that immediately comes to mind, that's exclusive. Insofar that you won't also find them on PS5 and/or PC.

But yeah there's actually a lot of really nice/good OG Xbox and Xbox 360 games that were exclusive. Or, in the case of something like Final Fantasy XIII (which is not good :tease), has sort of become console exclusive to anyone not willing/able to hook up their PS3 or play on PC. Lots of the games get native boosts in framerate and resolution, and it's not just literally "this game plays on the Xbone/Series" sort of deal. It's honestly the most defining trait of the Xbox platform at this point, especially as a stark contrast to Sony's lack of backcompat support for PS1/2/3, and it's a shame they 1) haven't pushed it more and 2) may be undoing a lot of it by going all digital.

So that's how it works! I'm guessing there are some games that are not compatible, or don't run well or something though, right? How has your experience been with this?
The games themselves run fantastically. There can be some less-than-intuitive UI stuff with figuring out how to download DLC, if applicable, but otherwise it very much Just Works™.

The list of what is and isn't compatible with One/Series can be found here, though there may be other lists elsewhere that are more easy to navigate. TrueAchievements for example is very accurate and also lets you sort by genre and the like, but doesn't list OG Xbox games as those don't have achievements.

Jeeeez, how can you even spot counterfeit games like this?
There are a bunch of different things - screws in the wrong place, logos/labels being lopsided, stuff like that - but particularly with the GBA games the Nintendo logo on the game's board/chip was a dead giveaway. Most didn't have a label at all, while others sometimes have it but it's not printed the same. Not my picture, but, something like this:

chip_logo.png
 

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We have the Series X and honestly there still isn't very much available for that that's worthwhile - and absolutely nothing, that immediately comes to mind, that's exclusive. Insofar that you won't also find them on PS5 and/or PC.
That's always been the issue with the Xbox brand tbh. I can't think of many exclusive games that are worth owning an Xbox for. Ninja Gaiden are the only ones I can think have that haven't been ported (without massively changing them)
 
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Most importantly. Am I the only one here bummed the fuck out by all this?
As a collector and a stubborn bitch I am extremely bummed about the inevitable switch to all digital. You never truly own a digital copy of anything. It can be whisked away on a whim, it's pathetic. I love physical media, I always will, and while I appreciate the ease of digital media, there's nothing like popping in a game and playing. To hell gaming that doesn't allow for physical media.
PS - what is the forum policy on emulation discussion?
Go for it, so long as we're not linking to specific things we're good :)
 
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Almost every game I buy nowadays is digital, but mainly out of laziness/impatience and the fact that half of them are PC games.
I do it because it's better than hunting down the physical version via Wal-Mart, Game Stop, or having to order it on Amazon or Ebay and wait a week or two to get it. Digital download is pretty much an instant win for me.
 

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I haven't read this whole thread, but in terms of digital, I don't like it or the push to it. I do not mind digital games. Hell, I play on Steam too. But to charge full price for a digital game is stupid. A game you STREAM? Even more dumb...

If they ever go full digital, it may be the end of my console gaming altogether.
 

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it may be the end of my console gaming altogether.
I do sometimes wonder if my aversion to PC games has increased my desire towards physical games, or if my desire for physical games makes me really averse to PC games.

In general though, I sit at a PC all day to work, so the last thing I want to do is sit there for fun too. :creepy2
 

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I do sometimes wonder if my aversion to PC games has increased my desire towards physical games, or if my desire for physical games makes me really averse to PC games.
I honestly think my aversion to PC games started somewhere around when I bought Might and Magic and the only way I could get the game to run because of the awful DRM was to pirate a copy, or maybe when I first played Oblivion and certain textures would display as technicolor static and wouldn't be resolved no matter if I installed mods or updated my graphics drivers.

It's nice to be able to pop a game in a console and not have to worry about trying to fine-tune it to fit your specific weird-ass unique PC.
 

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Yeah, the convenience of console will always trump PC for me. I've debated getting a gaming PC due to the possibilities but I don't game enough as is to justify it, let alone dealing with customization and optimization.
 

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Go for it, so long as we're not linking to specific things we're good
I just realized I had no idea where the forum rules were. They are not stickied in this forum. I guess they are in the Forum News forum.

Anyway, by "specific things" I take it to mean the actual game. I am going to link to this:


Maybe some of you have heard of these devices. They are a completely legal product on Amazon. They also happen to "run things" that were released up to about 2005, including previous portable incarnations. And they'll probably become more powerful as time goes on.

There's a whole subreddit called gameverifying where you can see tons of fakes. Basically if you are buying a Pokémon game online for GBA, it's probably fake. Full price or not.

This thread is reminding me of my absolute horror when I, as a kid, loaded up my Gold game and had no idea they all had a battery inside of them, and my massive save file was gone.

lol so yeah I kinda hate physical media, probably stems from that
 

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I just realized I had no idea where the forum rules were. They are not stickied in this forum. I guess they are in the Forum News forum.
That's a valid point, we should really link to those! Will get that fixed ASAP!
Anyway, by "specific things" I take it to mean the actual game. I am going to link to this:
Yep, we can't link to certain sites and definitely not to specific files, but devices like that are totally fine :)

Maybe some of you have heard of these devices. They are a completely legal product on Amazon. They also happen to "run things" that were released up to about 2005, including previous portable incarnations. And they'll probably become more powerful as time goes on.
I love these devices, great for accessibility and portability! I love the devices by Analogue, too, but they're meant more for physical media, but third party emulation consoles can be awesome (or crap, lol)!
 
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I just realized I had no idea where the forum rules were. They are not stickied in this forum. I guess they are in the Forum News forum.

Anyway, by "specific things" I take it to mean the actual game. I am going to link to this:


Maybe some of you have heard of these devices. They are a completely legal product on Amazon. They also happen to "run things" that were released up to about 2005, including previous portable incarnations. And they'll probably become more powerful as time goes on.



This thread is reminding me of my absolute horror when I, as a kid, loaded up my Gold game and had no idea they all had a battery inside of them, and my massive save file was gone.

lol so yeah I kinda hate physical media, probably stems from that

I don't understand the market for this thing, why not just get a Switch or 3DS or even a PS Vita and do the same thing but with access to a much larger catalog of games?
 
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Rachel

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do you mean other than the fact that the Vita is not in circulation anymore? And this is half its current cost? And the games on this cost nothing because you are emulating them, especially when you already own the physical media from years ago?

(My cursory glance on Amazon told me this at any rate)
 
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do you mean other than the fact that the Vita is not in circulation anymore? And this is half its current cost? And the games on this cost nothing because you are emulating them, especially when you already own the physical media from years ago?

(My cursory glance on Amazon told me this at any rate)
Vitas are like 100 bucks I think. They were only $200 very shortly after launch, right?

But yeah I mean you would emulate on the Vita/3DS/Switch as well. Like for example a PSVita for example can play all Vita, PSP, and PSX games natively and emulate any Nintendo system from N64 earlier. SNES and earlier will work perfectly.

3DS can play 3DS and DS games natively (and what a monstrous library that is!) but isn't powerful enough for PSX or N64 games. Can handle SNES/GBA and anything earlier very well though.

The benefits to this are I guess storage, but the new 3DS has a nifty FTP feature built in so you can just load games right off a home server and play them.
 
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I guess it depends on where you find the Vita. I see now they are cheaper on eBay but they are all used, and this thing is about the same price brand new.

But yeah I mean you would emulate on the Vita/3DS/Switch as well. Like for example a PSVita for example can play all Vita, PSP, and PSX games natively and emulate any Nintendo system from N64 earlier. SNES and earlier will work perfectly.
Probably depends on what you want. It's smaller than the Switch with more space. It can also emulate some Gamecube. Cheaper than the Steam Deck.

@Rick52 can you come in here and explain why this is preferred
 

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But to charge full price for a digital game is stupid. A game you STREAM? Even more dumb...
The fact that the Stadia held on for as long as it did still blows my mind, yeah.

As I touched on in the opening post, I assume the $50 price tag on Hellblade II is more because of Redfall being a $70 disaster last year and HB2 only being 8 hours long. However, let us not forget that The Order 1886 was ~7 hours long in 2015 with a $60 price point. As was Ryse: Son of Rome.

Absolutely no reason to think companies, Microsoft chief among them, won't continue to push $70 as the new normal while having no physical releases and while continuing to push DLC. I wouldn't expect Deluxe and Special Edition things to cease to exist either, again just not physically - thereby being about as stupid as is actually possible.

Maybe some of you have heard of these devices. They are a completely legal product on Amazon. They also happen to "run things" that were released up to about 2005, including previous portable incarnations. And they'll probably become more powerful as time goes on.
Heard of them, aye. I reckon once I start doing emulation I'm just going full pirate and never looking back. Nintendo's already so far beyond the pale that I struggle very hard to care about anything they release, especially anything that could potentially have DLC (RIP Fire Emblem and Xenoblade), because I know their digital storefronts will continue to get nuked.

On the subject of emulation though, Xbox Series S actually had momentum for a while at least in part because it was probably the easiest and most powerful emulation box a super casual tinkerer could get their hands on. Something like just using the Edge browser included with the console to install stuff and you were off to the races. Pretty sure Microsoft has poo pooed that parade at least in part by now, though.


I don't understand the market for this thing, why not just get a Switch or 3DS or even a PS Vita and do the same thing but with access to a much larger catalog of games?
Always an ease of use thing. Even if flashing/modding is easy, people are apprehensive. See also: Why Alienwares (continue to) exist, why people pay $50 or more to have the battery in their iPhone replaced "professionally."
 
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All this talk of modding - I have both a jailbroken/modded PSP and PS3 to basically play anything from that generation and beyond.
 

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All this talk of modding - I have both a jailbroken/modded PSP and PS3 to basically play anything from that generation and beyond.
I used to hoard original Xboxes when they were at garage sales for around about $1 or $5 and mod them, modchips, softmods, anything at all. Turned them into media centers with XBMC (now Kodi... :( ) or just loaded them with games and emulators. Fun times!
 

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I used to hoard original Xboxes when they were at garage sales for around about $1 or $5 and mod them, modchips, softmods, anything at all. Turned them into media centers with XBMC (now Kodi... :( ) or just loaded them with games and emulators. Fun times!
My one and only Xbox was modded - would always copy games I rented to the hard drive.

All this talk of digital vs physical while watching a nostalgic FFVI review reminds me of another reason I hate digital vs physical.

The whole FF Pixel Remaster debacle on Playstation.
 

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My one and only Xbox was modded - would always copy games I rented to the hard drive.

All this talk of digital vs physical while watching a nostalgic FFVI review reminds me of another reason I hate digital vs physical.

The whole FF Pixel Remaster debacle on Playstation.
Remasters in general...terrible money grab efforts.

Modded Xboxes were so much fun, lol. You could do everything with them.
 
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The whole FF Pixel Remaster debacle on Playstation.
Square just doesn't like money, it's fascinating.

Standard physical release would've sold gangbusters, even at $90 or whatever the hell they wanted to charge. Older people seeing it in store and impulse buying because nostalgia? Score!

...And where the fuck is my Xbox port already, Square? JFC.

And why was it PC exclusive for so long??
 
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Remasters in general...terrible money grab efforts.
Generally speaking I definitely agree, but this is more a case of, I want the damn physical copy but can't get it.
Square just doesn't like money, it's fascinating.

Standard physical release would've sold gangbusters, even at $90 or whatever the hell they wanted to charge. Older people seeing it in store and impulse buying because nostalgia? Score!

...And where the fuck is my Xbox port already, Square? JFC.

And why was it PC exclusive for so long??
It blows my mind that they went crazy with it for the Switch but were so limited with PS4.

Square does weird fucking things.
 

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And I learned about this last night, missed the shitstorm when it first happened earlier in the month:

Article:
The question remains around the potential of the subscription model in games. Tremblay says that there is "tremendous opportunity for growth", but what is it going to take for subscription to step up and become a more significant proportion of the industry?

"I don't have a crystal ball, but when you look at the different subscription services that are out there, we've had a rapid expansion over the last couple of years, but it's still relatively small compared to the other models," he begins. "We're seeing expansion on console as the likes of PlayStation and Xbox bring new people in. On PC, from a Ubisoft standpoint, it's already been great, but we are looking to reach out more on PC, so we see opportunity there.

"One of the things we saw is that gamers are used to, a little bit like DVD, having and owning their games. That's the consumer shift that needs to happen. They got comfortable not owning their CD collection or DVD collection. That's a transformation that's been a bit slower to happen [in games]. As gamers grow comfortable in that aspect… you don't lose your progress. If you resume your game at another time, your progress file is still there. That's not been deleted. You don't lose what you've built in the game or your engagement with the game. So it's about feeling comfortable with not owning your game.

"I still have two boxes of DVDs. I definitely understand the gamers perspective with that. But as people embrace that model, they will see that these games will exist, the service will continue, and you'll be able to access them when you feel like. That's reassuring.

"Streaming is also a thing that works really well with subscription. So you pay when you need it, as opposed to paying all the time."


Bolded is, obviously, what everyone focuses on. He's a services guy talking from a services perspective, so "owning" in scare quotes to the extreme as well.

The Netflix comparison is apt. Game Pass Ultimate is kind of like Netflix, Sony's shit is kind of like Hulu. And they're already - have already, for a long time - speed-running to the part where every one of the individual large publishers have their own equivalent. Right now, EA Play is included with your Game Pass Ultimate. Like Ubisoft+, which isn't, that won't last forever.
 

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More smoke? More smoke.


If timestamp doesn't work, it's the very last thing they discuss - at the 26 minute mark.


A transcript courtesy of user --R on ResetEra:
I was told by a major publisher, about just before Christmas, that across Europe several retailers have started just not listing Xbox anymore. Right, so they've just stopped stocking Xbox games because the digital, the Xbox is such a digital console now. The physical performance of Xbox games is really low and ultimately when you're selling a console that most people are just downloading games for, it doesn't really benefit the retailer very much. The margin on hardware is often quite small so, I wasn't able to corroborate that, I couldn't find which retailers these are, but it was a proper senior European publishing boss that said it to me.

I wouldn't be surprised if some of this is "Xbox is pushing away from physical" but I don't think physical retailers are gonna care. They might still sell controllers and things like that but ultimately, Xbox is so digital, like you think PC and Mobile being digital dominated, but Xbox is not that far back anymore. PlayStation's a little further behind and Nintendo is a little bit further behind that, but it's [Xbox] such a digital dominant console so I wouldn't be surprised if some of these moves [The layoffs to the department that handles physical releases] are just necessary, you don't need as many people focusing on box shifting when, ultimately, fewer retailers are stocking your product.

With the current rumor that both Hi-Fi Rush and Sea of Thieves are going multiplatform (i.e., releasing on Switch and possibly PS4/5), I... can only wish Microsoft and Xbox the best of luck with this if it's truly a push on their end. They're ostensibly betting the farm on Call of Duty carrying them, and - especially if Call of Duty isn't a physical gift to give kids on your platform any longer - I don't know that that pans out?

Counter to the subject of this thread, then: Should Microsoft disappear from retailers, but Sony and Nintendo carry on this and next generation - Xbox may well just entirely cease. And I don't know, necessarily, that anyone is jonesing to pay $15 a month for a Microsoft Gaming service on their PlayStation, Switch or PC when their first-party output is so extraordinarily lethargic.
 
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